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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2010 21:08:17 GMT -5
Two rhetorical questions. First, why did Noah say that Luke was more focused? He doesn't seem any more focused to me than he was in the past. It's just bizarre to me. I was waiting for someone to point that out. I felt the same way, but then thought that it’s very much in line with a few things the show’s been trying to make us believe has been happening the last few weeks or so. Luke might be focused, but it’s definitely not on anything about his personal drive and coming into his own singularly. Noah being all proud and Luke’s “Aw, shucks” reaction just made me shake my head and smile though. Crazy kids. ;D Uh, because Noah's special? Eh, I didn't pay too much attention to it. I think they all just like the guy or something. It's not like he really has anyone else anyway. Considering he's lived in Java for the past couple of years, who knows how he'll get by in LA with all the additional filming equipment expenses piling up too? I think people can believe what they want to believe. ATWT has given too little to its viewers to feel happy or hopeful about for me to want to take more away from anyone. I can only state what I think and leave it at that. The show’s over and the possibilities are endless for those still standing, especially in soap land. Sparring about it would make even less sense than sparring about what actually happened onscreen.
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Post by anthonyl on Sept 16, 2010 21:28:07 GMT -5
Speaking for myself I never cared for Luke and Noah as a couple. I don't believe they are this 'forever' and 'destined' couple and I never have. And since we can imagine any future want for Luke since it's all in the realm of fan fic and not canon, I prefer to think of one without Noah.
As we saw with Reid, there are other men in the world who might be a good match for Luke that he could be happy with, though it was cut short before they had the chance to really see where it could go. What I remember most about Luke and Noah's relationship is, at least in my view, is that while they loved each other, it was riddled with dysfunction and Luke spent far too much time unhappy.
As Noah hasn't changed all that much since they met, I don't wish that again on Luke, not after he's freed himself of it. FTR, Luke hasn't changed that much either, which is why they remain incompatible and destined to only continue to hurt each other. Some folks have their version of what they want for Luke, and there are others who have a complete other future in mind for him. Neither are wrong and neither are right. They're just different.
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LadyArmand
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Post by LadyArmand on Sept 16, 2010 21:47:59 GMT -5
Speaking for myself I never cared for Luke and Noah as a couple. I don't believe they are this 'forever' and 'destined' couple and I never have. And since we can imagine any future want for Luke since it's all in the realm of fan fic and not canon, I prefer to think of one without Noah. As we saw with Reid, there are other men in the world who might be a good match for Luke that he could be happy with, though it was cut short before they had the chance to really see where it could go. What I remember most about Luke and Noah's relationship is, at least in my view, is that while they loved each other, it was riddled with dysfunction and Luke spent far too much time unhappy. As Noah hasn't changed all that much since they met, I don't wish that again on Luke, not after he's freed himself of it. FTR, Luke hasn't changed that much either, which is why they remain incompatible and destined to only continue to hurt each other. Some folks have their version of what they want for Luke, and there are others who have a complete other future in mind for him. Neither are wrong and neither are right. They're just different. anthonyl That’s the most honest comment I’ve read of yours since I’ve been lurking and posting here in this thread. I prefer this to most of the other things you've said that I've found to be bashing, condescending and hypocritical.
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Post by caitlinp on Sept 16, 2010 22:57:44 GMT -5
I I think Luke and Noah, like most first loves, have a deep connection, but I'd really like to know what happened today that leaves the door open to a reconciliation.
If Luke was into the kiss, he didn't even take his hands out of his pockets while it was happening, or if he had initiated the kiss, that would have been a sign that he is open to restarting his relationship with Noah.
If Luke had told Noah flat out that he would go with him, but he's still mourning Reid, or that he would come be with him, after a little more time had passed, then I would see that as an opening.
If Luke had even returned Noah's "I love You" I would see that as an opening, even though Luke told Noah weeks ago that he would always have feelings for him, but that they were not meant to be together. The scenes today didn't indicate to me that Luke and Noah will get back together anymore than Janet and Jack's indicated that they will also reunite sometime in the future.
Today, the only person who was open to restarting the relationship was Noah. But for me, more importantly than that, a storyline isn't built around just one scene or one episode (despite what ATWT has done this week to indicate otherwise), Luke has put his feelings out in the open for several months, and nothing in his words or actions indicates that he wants to get back together with Noah.
In the end, it doesn't matter. The show will be over tomorrow, and unless something happens, Luke and Noah won't be together. If people want to put them together in fan fiction that's fine, just like it's fine if people want to write stories about Luke hooking up with some lumberjack named Jacques. Both carry the same weight and relevance.
But honestly, I'm open minded, maybe if someone can refrain from hurling insults, they could list for me the things that Luke did in today's scenes that indicated that he's open to getting back together with Noah.
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Post by caitlinp on Sept 16, 2010 23:01:52 GMT -5
But, is this what you actually saw? That website, just like Goutman and JP, often lists things in a way that doesn't jibe with what actually happened. So, my question is still, what specifically happened in the scene that would indicate that Luke is open to rekindling his relationship with Noah? We know what Noah wants, but it takes two people to have a relationship, and in this case, one person is just not willing. The issue isn't whether or not these two "could" restart their relatioship, the show is over, so that's a matter left up to fan fiction, the question is whether or not anything happened on Thursday that would indicate that this is what Luke wants, or that he is currently open to the idea.
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Post by arcticvoth on Sept 17, 2010 3:30:18 GMT -5
"But honestly, I'm open minded, maybe if someone can refrain from hurling insults, they could list for me the things that Luke did in today's scenes that indicated that he's open to getting back together with Noah." caitlinp
Thank you caitlinp. I, too, am somewhat perturbed by other people just not accepting that the Luke and Noah situation is what it is. There was nothing in Luke's body language (or words) that indicated he was suddenly into Noah again - and that's okay.
This is not a who does Luke love more competition. Yeeesh! It's about people who change over time. You all might remember that Noah was a bumhead not so long ago, but in Luke's hour of need Noah was there. Why was he there? Because he loved Luke enough to be there. Noah loved Luke enough to hear what Luke was saying and even had to stick up for Reid. This doesn't mean that we should all start anticipating the future for anyone (which has been left up to us anyway), however it should be an indication that Noah is a good man too. Can we all just leave it at that?
Recently I have been watching old Luke and Noah and, frankly, it has nothing on Luke and Reid (personal opinion). Different chemistry with both couples and that is cool. Everyone chill! If anything - if we want to project our emotions anywhere in relation to make believe people - let's be happy that Luke may have just found himself. Noah even said so. Let's leave it at that and just stop his silliness.
We're all people on a planet and it's okay to be different.
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md1347
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Post by md1347 on Sept 17, 2010 7:53:59 GMT -5
www.soapoperanetwork.com/soaps/ratings/3096-ratings-great-week-for-soapsRatings for September 6-10, 2010 Total Viewers 1. Y&R 5,117,000 (+144,000/+119,000) 2. B&B 3,251,000 (+107,000/+21,000) 3. GH 2,742,000 (+82,000/-45,000) 4. ATWT 2,575,000 (+207,000/+227,000) 5. DAYS 2,494,000 (+51,000/-226,000) 6. AMC 2,468,000 (+48,000/+7,000) 7. OLTL 2,457,000 (+82,000/-22,000) HH 1. Y&R 3.5/12 (same/-.1) 2. B&B 2.3/8 (+.1/-.1) 3. GH 2.0/6 (+.1/-.1) 4. AMC 1.9/7 (+.1/same) 4. ATWT 1.9/6 (+.2/+.1) 6. OLTL 1.8/6 (+.1/-.1) 6. DAYS 1.8/6 (same/-.2) <- ties low rating (10th straight week) Day-To-Day Ratings - HH/Total Viewers ATWT Monday: Tuesday: 1.8/2,582,000 Wednesday: 1.9/2,545,000 Thursday: 1.9/2,598,000 Friday: Click on the link above to view entire ratings information.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2010 8:09:03 GMT -5
I love how you said, arcticvoth, that it’s not a competition but you still also had to mention that Luke/Noah had nothing on Luke/Reid. But I agree on the principle. The show’s over and done with, the story’s been told the way it was, and people’s past and future perceptions/preferences will always differ and I’ll always respect that. If people are not happy – and I think pretty much no one is – my feeling is that their energy might be better spent on directing their anger/disappointment/frustration on TPTB. They were always the real problem anyway. This is just typical of the show and the people running it. We can hardly fault them for being consistent in the unsatisfactory storytelling department, can we? Also, the rampant discrimination all things considered is one thing I can most understand uniformly getting riled up about. This is how I’ve seen it from my end: Noah became a device in the furthering of Luke/Reid. As soon as Luke/Reid materialized, Luke quickly became just a device in the furthering of the Reid evolution story. As the Reid story took shape, it turned out to be a major tool in the furthering of the big straight love of Chris/Katie who by the way got to consummate said love and ride off into the sunset. All of them being props for the great Emmy plan TPTB cooked up and probably pat themselves in the back for being so creative to come up with. The fact that all three gay characters, each in their own way, particularly the legacy character, were casualties is purely coincidental, and hey, at least we got them onscreen, right? Funny how the perfect ending for me used to be all three characters being single (couldn’t get on board with either ship for the foreseeable end especially in the last months, the feeling getting worse each passing episode), significantly grown and at least content, if not happy. No roses and rides into the sunset necessary, or even anything that might have been considered too cheesy – for gay couples (the qualifier seems necessary since said cheesiness in endings is acceptable for straight couples). And if they couldn’t do something so basic and logical, at least bring out the cheesiness with something epic, or groundbreaking, or even positively over-the-top in soapiness. But even that was too hard to accomplish it seems. Thanks, ATWT! Personally, I’m more taken by the fact that looking back, the shows or storylines with gay characters that I've watched with more or less picked interest till the end always kind of ended terribly or unsatisfactorily for me. Enough to start getting me worried about AWZ now. (Nah, I’ll just keep faith in the fact that it could end up being crap and Dennis/Igor might still convince me that it’s totally awesome. ;D)
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Post by Bonobochick on Sept 17, 2010 8:17:39 GMT -5
Folks, let's not make things personal. I understand that the ending has brought about some raw feelings for some but let's keep things about the show & characters.
Thanks
Last day...
Thanks
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Post by Hawthorne on Sept 17, 2010 10:59:15 GMT -5
I thought the fact that Luke was talking about how his grandma must never give up fighting for her relationship with his mom just as Noah was sitting down at his table was interesting timing. If you're looking for some Nuke hope, there's that. If Noah never gives up fighting for Luke, I think he's got a good chance of eventually getting him. He's proven his love by being there for Luke when it must have been difficult for him to see how much Luke loved Reid. Plus, it's clear that Luke and his entire family plan to stay heavily involved with Noah. So ... there are reasons for hope with Nuke, IMO, but nothing's for sure, of course.
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md1347
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Post by md1347 on Sept 17, 2010 11:19:49 GMT -5
FYI... there is some talk about Susan Dansby helping some Nuke fans write an epilogue for Nuke. The finished story may be put on the PGP site.
update: Looks like she did an interview with Atlanta Journal Constitution where she said this. I checked their site and couldn't find the article... who's from Atlanta?
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Post by Bonobochick on Sept 17, 2010 11:54:00 GMT -5
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md1347
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Post by md1347 on Sept 17, 2010 11:57:14 GMT -5
Yup, I did too finally... LOL.. Susan Dansby quote:
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Post by Bonobochick on Sept 17, 2010 13:06:40 GMT -5
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md1347
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Post by md1347 on Sept 17, 2010 14:37:03 GMT -5
Wasn't impressed with the end... GL was better, IMO.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2010 15:57:45 GMT -5
No kidding. I didn’t feel an overwhelming warmth or heart in the episode, or even a really poignant homage to everything the show has had over its long run, even if a lot was supposed to be positive. I also love how the last 30 minutes of the show revolved around every single character being happy, content or hopeful … but for Luke Snyder whose final scene basically consisted in grieving, not even in a complete sense of closure. Awesome. And so ATWT.
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aliceg
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Post by aliceg on Sept 17, 2010 17:02:24 GMT -5
I hated the ending to both Luke and Noah's character. Yes, maybe, there is some hope for them as a couple because Luke could always join Noah in LA but tbh, it was handled badly and poorly written as usual. This storyline started with so much promise but they ruined every possibility it had. I do wonder how it would have turned out if the show hadn't been cancelled but alas we shall never know. With episodes so poorly written, no wonder it got cut. Poor Luke and Noah, you deserved so much more. Poor Jake and Van, you had so much more potential!! I'm highly disappointed with how it turned out
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md1347
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Post by md1347 on Sept 17, 2010 21:34:23 GMT -5
Susan's is hearing a lot of negative, actually quite disturbingly mean, tweets to her twitter account from Reid/LuRe fans about her idea to do an Luke and Noah epilogue. I find the tweets to be pretty disturbing and out right mean. I won't post them here so I won't violate forum rules. tweet her if you like the idea, please... @susandansby
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Post by anthonyl on Sept 17, 2010 21:54:40 GMT -5
Wow. That's really unfortunate. I personally don't have a problem with it and I'm not a fan of the couple. If she wants to write some fan fic with the fans, more power to her, it's not like it changes the ending. But I think it was a bad idea for her to get involved. I find it... strange that after she was completely trashed by some fans, they're all too eager to have her write some fan fic to pimp their agenda. Frankly though, the show is over, both sides need to let it go and move on. I still can't believe all this fighting over it.
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md1347
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Post by md1347 on Sept 18, 2010 8:07:34 GMT -5
^^^ actually, I've been surprised by the cool reaction to Susan writing a fanfic by Nuke fans.
I don't mind her doing it and I'd be interested in seeing what she comes up with but that's just me.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2010 8:27:09 GMT -5
LOL, this is quite pathetic. Writing or not writing some type of fanfiction is not going to resurrect Reid. Fandom and its crazies. Are the Nuke fans really that on pins and needles about this random idea anyway? It’s not like it’ll be shown on the show or anything. And if the Nuke fans had a cool reaction as md1347 states, how is this idea by this writer about Nuke fans pushing an agenda? I’m a little confused and bemused by all of this infighting. If it was a fight about the most amazing ways TPTB have sucked, I’d get it. But this? It’s things like that that make me glad I basically stick to this board, and that I’m apparently one of the few who’re still mostly clueless about Twitter.
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Post by Bonobochick on Sept 18, 2010 10:28:10 GMT -5
md1347, that is disgusting. I get being unhappy if you don't agree with what she's doing but being such rude jackasses to her about it? Ick. I hope she doesn't back track due to people being obnoxious to her on her twitter. Way for some folks to keep it classy.
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md1347
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Post by md1347 on Sept 18, 2010 10:56:16 GMT -5
LOL, this is quite pathetic. Writing or not writing some type of fanfiction is not going to resurrect Reid. Fandom and its crazies. Are the Nuke fans really that on pins and needles about this random idea anyway? It’s not like it’ll be shown on the show or anything. And if the Nuke fans had a cool reaction as md1347 states, how is this idea by this writer about Nuke fans pushing an agenda? I’m a little confused and bemused by all of this infighting. If it was a fight about the most amazing ways TPTB have sucked, I’d get it. But this? It’s things like that that make me glad I basically stick to this board, and that I’m apparently one of the few who’re still mostly clueless about Twitter. The 2 fanbases will never mesh again, IMO, macari. That's just my own opinion though. It's been pretty vicious at times between both sides for a while now and I don't think it will calm down at all now that the show is over. It will just disappear as the show is "forgotten" (let go) by fans. While I'm curious about what she comes up with. It will never bring Nuke back together on the screen, just like it will never bring Reid back to life.
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Post by anthonyl on Sept 18, 2010 11:12:37 GMT -5
I don't think that they'll ever come together either. There's too much viciousness, pettiness and anger on both sides. And well, there is no middle ground here so that's to be expected. I just think they should just stop fighting about it.
In terms of the SD fan fic, to me, it seemed to me (according to posts I saw) that Luke/Noah fans were excited about it as it would be posted on the PGP board and they can deem a L/N reunion as canon because it's endorsed by TeleNext, much like the AWT story is/has been. It would be the definitive ending that the show did not give them and go along with their belief that Luke and Noah are 'forever', even though the ending (actually the last year of the show) told us they are not or at least they may not be anyway.
I could be misinterpreting the situation, but that's how it came across to me.
She (or anybody else) can write what they want. I don't read fan fic so it doesn't affect me one way or other.
But I think that folks should hold off on the 'we would NEVER do something like that'. I think the last 9 months have proven that everybody on all sides is capable of inappropriate behavior, though most seem to be level headed, clear thinking people who have this in perspective. Still, as a friend of mine said 'these two fandoms are closer alike than not'.
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LadyArmand
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Post by LadyArmand on Sept 18, 2010 18:07:33 GMT -5
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D I’m laughing, because all those people who say they don’t care seem to want to write long drawn out paragraphs about why they don’t care and why it doesn’t effect them if a fanfic gets written, because it’s sooooooooooo over between Noah and Luke. I just think it’s hilarious all this not caring….. Me thinks thou doth protest a little bit too much.
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