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Post by lolaruns on Aug 11, 2011 13:03:23 GMT -5
BTW, Andi once again stole a story we wanted (messing up a date because he can't stop gushing about Helena).
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Post by blaykee on Aug 11, 2011 13:05:15 GMT -5
I"m interested to know what Jessica and Dana talked about in NL, I heard "Christian and Olli"
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ari
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Posts: 855
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Post by ari on Aug 11, 2011 13:11:12 GMT -5
Wow, I can't believe how excited I got when I saw the boys in the same room together, saying actual words to each other! lollll I miss them soo much Now that Toby's gone, get Theresa out of the damn picture, we all know Christian and Olli are trying so hard not to care and so hard to forget about each other. When will they realize its pointless and they still love each other?!?! Exactly Chrolli7, it's pointless, but you know this show..ugh!!! I loved the scene because it looks to me like it will begin Christian's "missing the intensity" phase. Christian's scenes were all about Olli, finding out about the tryst and then seeing for himself how happy and satisfied Olli was while picking up a romantic dinner for two. They're both denying their true feelings, but I think Christian was more affected by what he saw. Olli seemed to take seeing Teresa in stride.
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Post by angelica on Aug 11, 2011 13:18:33 GMT -5
Jo, looks as if he's been doin his crunches, looks good....... ;D
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Post by lolaruns on Aug 11, 2011 13:29:32 GMT -5
I"m interested to know what Jessica and Dana talked about in NL, I heard "Christian and Olli" Dana said Jessica was responsible for breaking up Helandi and Chrolli. Then they talked about One Night Stands. (I'll leave it up to Mary to post the details)
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AndreB
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Post by AndreB on Aug 11, 2011 13:29:57 GMT -5
is Christian jealous or it was just his wounded pride ?? ..anyway...I'm sorry , but in my eyes he's still in his ass..e mood I think that wounded pride might be the right impression, I couldn't point my finger on Christian's emotion myself, but this explanation sounds plausible. All in all, it felt like from the Twilight Zone, with this talk that Christian and Olli are a great couple and should make up and cheating is not a big deal. Whatever. It sounds like writers have lost the feeling of reality in this story. But it's no wonder, with Tanja's story and all. ;D
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Post by blaykee on Aug 11, 2011 13:48:56 GMT -5
I"m interested to know what Jessica and Dana talked about in NL, I heard "Christian and Olli" Dana said Jessica was responsible for breaking up Helandi and Chrolli. Then they talked about One Night Stands. (I'll leave it up to Mary to post the details) thanks for the info, so they are still bringing that up? hm...
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Post by lolaruns on Aug 11, 2011 14:08:09 GMT -5
Dana said Jessica was responsible for breaking up Helandi and Chrolli. Then they talked about One Night Stands. (I'll leave it up to Mary to post the details) thanks for the info, so they are still bringing that up? hm... To me the way the scene played out it felt like another example of it really happening. I dunno. Just in the way Dana and Jessica talked about, in the context of ONSs and what they mean and how you can overcome them. (there also wasn't any dundundun sounds or cuts to Jessica looking shifty) It just seems like it would be out of character for Jessica to keep up that elaborate a charade to all kinds of people for something that at this point doesn't really matter to her anymore.
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pru
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FREE OLLI NOW!
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Post by pru on Aug 11, 2011 14:16:57 GMT -5
DAYUM, joanna!
Thank you so much for providing these pics.
Olli should be arrested for being so damn FIONE! Have MERCY!
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pru
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FREE OLLI NOW!
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Post by pru on Aug 11, 2011 14:20:05 GMT -5
thanks for the info, so they are still bringing that up? hm... To me the way the scene played out it felt like another example of it really happening. I dunno. Just in the way Dana and Jessica talked about, in the context of ONSs and what they mean and how you can overcome them. (there also wasn't any dundundun sounds or cuts to Jessica looking shifty) It just seems like it would be out of character for Jessica to keep up that elaborate a charade to all kinds of people for something that at this point doesn't really matter to her anymore. Exactly, lolaruns. She slept with Andi and Christian, point. Blank. Period. And if others don't wanna believe it...can't help ya.
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mitsaso
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Post by mitsaso on Aug 11, 2011 14:35:16 GMT -5
thanks for the info, so they are still bringing that up? hm... To me the way the scene played out it felt like another example of it really happening. I dunno. Just in the way Dana and Jessica talked about, in the context of ONSs and what they mean and how you can overcome them. (there also wasn't any dundundun sounds or cuts to Jessica looking shifty) It just seems like it would be out of character for Jessica to keep up that elaborate a charade to all kinds of people for something that at this point doesn't really matter to her anymore. Well, Jessica doesn't really have to actively TRY and hide it, since none of the guys remembers anything yet and they've accepted that they probably did something. And, really, revealing it at this point would just bring her more trouble in her already difficult relationships with the flatshare people. Olli, the only person we know she cares about, would flip out, and we've already seen he's not afraid of calling on her bullshit and kicking her out. In fact, the way they keep refering to the threesome although it is now beside the point (Chrolli are completely broken up and more busy dealing with each other's current dates and affairs instead of Jessica, Helandi are also on an entirely different SL), is what points to me that VL doesn't wanna forget about it because it obviously wants to come back to that fateful night at some point. A great example of that was the scene with Chrolli fighting over the water damage bills; Christian says that Jessica, having done the damage, has to pay for it too, and Olli says out of nowhere "NOBODY FORCED YOU TO SLEEP WITH JESSICA" as if it had anything to do with the water damage. In a first look, it seems just like Olli being overly bitchy again. But, if we look deeper into that, the writers forced that bit in the dialogue to "remind" us of the threesome. Christian would demand that Jessica pays even if he hadn't "slept" with her... hell, even if he actually considered her a friend!
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Post by lolaruns on Aug 11, 2011 14:39:33 GMT -5
But she actively talked about it with Dana when that was not necessary. If it's a lie then it's additional effort to keep the lie up with a large number of people if she keeps talking about it. That's what I mean effort, keeping the story alive when it's no longer of use to her (she got what she wanted: the job with Tanja).
And I still think that if they wanted us to think that she's lying they would make a point of her looking shifty (music cues, directing cues). Instead the scenes just seem normal to me.
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LadyArmand
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"Fortune favors the bold..." Virgil
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Post by LadyArmand on Aug 11, 2011 14:40:36 GMT -5
To me the way the scene played out it felt like another example of it really happening. I dunno. Just in the way Dana and Jessica talked about, in the context of ONSs and what they mean and how you can overcome them. (there also wasn't any dundundun sounds or cuts to Jessica looking shifty) It just seems like it would be out of character for Jessica to keep up that elaborate a charade to all kinds of people for something that at this point doesn't really matter to her anymore. Exactly, lolaruns. She slept with Andi and Christian, point. Blank. Period. And if others don't wanna believe it...can't help ya. Pru Hope dies last. The hope that it's a lie I think is making some people feel a little better about this whole fucked up story line. Personally while in the beginning I thought Jessica might have lied to both Andi and Chrisitan, I didnt actually hold out much hope. I say that because of Christian's past actions when it comes to him being angry with Olli. That and the fact that it didn't take much convinicing for him to actually believe he'd done it. He still hasn't really questioned it, because even if he can't remember it he knows himself to be perfectly capable of it.
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robin1
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Post by robin1 on Aug 11, 2011 14:47:45 GMT -5
thanks joanna for the caps...
the pics of olli huggs jessica are so stupid... i mean SHE's the one because the marriage is over.... and now they're living and working together... this is stupid, stupid, stupid... even for a soap, dear writers!
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mitsaso
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Post by mitsaso on Aug 11, 2011 14:50:28 GMT -5
But she actively talked about it with Dana when that was not necessary. If it's a lie then it's additional effort to keep the lie up with a large number of people if she keeps talking about it. That's what I mean effort, keeping the story alive when it's no longer of use to her (she got what she wanted: the job with Tanja). And I still think that if they wanted us to think that she's lying they would make a point of her looking shifty (music cues, directing cues). Instead the scenes just seem normal to me. It would be additional effort if Dana had asked her about details and Jessica had to mention/make up some. For now, she's just sticking with the status quo. And still, admitting out of nowhere that she lied could only bring bad things her way. For now the blame is mostly on Andi and Christian, if she ever admitted otherwise it would be all on her. It's not that I really care about VL retconning away the threesome anymore. It's just that it feels like a really "VL" thing to do. After they have Chrolli go through a lot of stuff without each other, they can easily remove the initial cause, but not the symptoms, and use the reveal as a first step/realization of how stupid the boys had been, before they try to rectify all the stupid stuff that followed the "threesome". As for the no cues that would make things obvious factor, it's just that; they want to keep people guessing. Otherwise they'd have used this wondrous opportunity to sell us some more sex, with Andi/Jessica/Christian making out on the couch before doing the deed. VL might shy away from the infidelity sex scenes, but not the kissing before them! (see; Theresa).
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Post by blaykee on Aug 11, 2011 14:51:39 GMT -5
I don't hold out "hope" as you say, them finding out an alternate truth isn't going to change where they are now. It won't erase the pain. And the night with Jessica isn't the only reason they broke up. I just find it interesting they keep harping on it, it was so many months ago.
eta: what mitsaso said ^^^but better than me.
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LadyArmand
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"Fortune favors the bold..." Virgil
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Post by LadyArmand on Aug 11, 2011 14:56:30 GMT -5
thanks joanna for the caps... the pics of olli huggins jessica are so stupid... i mean SHE's the one because the marriage is over.... and now they're living and working together... this is stupid, stupid, stupid... even for a soap, dear writers! She was there, but she never made any promises of love and fidelity to Olli, she didn't get up in a church and vow her undying love to Olli either. So while she is not blameless she's not the whole reason. Olli played his part as did Christian. And since they are the ones who were/are married to each other, the lions share of the blame falls to them.
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mitsaso
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Post by mitsaso on Aug 11, 2011 15:00:47 GMT -5
thanks joanna for the caps... the pics of olli huggins jessica are so stupid... i mean SHE's the one because the marriage is over.... and now they're living and working together... this is stupid, stupid, stupid... even for a soap, dear writers! She was there, but she never made any promises of love and fidelity to Olli, she didn't get up in a church and vow her undying love to Olli either. So while she is not blameless she's not the whole reason. Olli played his part as did Christian. And since they are the ones who were/are married to each other, the lions share of the blame falls to them. Of course Christian is mostly who Olli should be concerned about, but it still doesn't excuse Olli befriending and forgiving Jessica about everything. It's not like she even said she was sorry about it! They're not even using the "I slept with your husband but that's okay because we weren't friend yet back then" reasoning! I'm still waiting for my own "Jessica" to come back from Sacramento so that I can deal with his sorry excuse of a human being P.S. If any Chrolli fan in Sacramento or California in general is reading this, and they don't have a problem with removing a human life, PM me.
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Post by lolaruns on Aug 11, 2011 15:03:38 GMT -5
I think that's my problem with it, that it doesn't feel like a VL thing to do to me with the way it is told.
For one as a show VL sadly has never been all that good about paying attention to detail (and they have even less reason to do that for minor storylines) or about paying attention to the things fans care about (like anniversaries, preserving a couple's special place or song).
VL just doesn't do "subtle" (except by coincidence).
Right now VL is telling a whole bucket of secret stories. And they are all told the same way. Having the viewers know the truth (to create this feeling of frustration and yelling the characters for the truth to finally come out), having the characters all act very obvious whenever they are lying, etc.
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mitsaso
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Post by mitsaso on Aug 11, 2011 15:13:33 GMT -5
I think that's my problem with it, that it doesn't feel like a VL thing to do to me with the way it is told. For one as a show VL sadly has never been all that good about paying attention to detail (and they have even less reason to do that for minor storylines) or about paying attention to the things fans care about (like anniversaries, preserving a couple's special place or song). VL just doesn't do "subtle" (except by coincidence). Right now VL is telling a whole bucket of secret stories. And they are all told the same way. Having the viewers know the truth (to create this feeling of frustration and yelling the characters for the truth to finally come out), having the characters all act very obvious whenever they are lying, etc. Oh yes, you are totally right on the subtlety thing. If VL wasn't still hammering us with mentions of the threesome, I would have accepted that it happened and the show moved on already. But since they keep force-feeding us with throwbacks to the threesome, I can't help but think that there's gonna be a payoff on that. And frankly, if they had made obvious from the start that Jessica was lying, all the things that followed would be THAT much more frustrating. Olli, especially, would be losing every credibility in his reactions if we knew for sure from the start that Christian didn't do anything. Except for a certain person or two who would still defend him to the death. The threesome concept is still badly conceptualized in every aspect, still. It's so retarded it makes my head hurt. Three characters having a threesome out of nowhere and nobody remembers? Them doing it with the last woman in the cast they would (especially Andi)? Having a gay/bi man in the mix and never even CONSIDERING that it wasn't a completely straight threesome? Whichever aspect you pick from the whole thing, it just fails.
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LadyArmand
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Post by LadyArmand on Aug 11, 2011 15:22:39 GMT -5
She was there, but she never made any promises of love and fidelity to Olli, she didn't get up in a church and vow her undying love to Olli either. So while she is not blameless she's not the whole reason. Olli played his part as did Christian. And since they are the ones who were/are married to each other, the lions share of the blame falls to them. Of course Christian is mostly who Olli should be concerned about, but it still doesn't excuse Olli befriending and forgiving Jessica about everything. It's not like she even said she was sorry about it! They're not even using the "I slept with your husband but that's okay because we weren't friend yet back then" reasoning! I'm still waiting for my own "Jessica" to come back from Sacramento so that I can deal with his sorry excuse of a human being P.S. If any Chrolli fan in Sacramento or California in general is reading this, and they don't have a problem with removing a human life, PM me.I'm not saying it in any way makes sense or excuses Olli befrending her. But this is a soap, and since I've been watching soaps for nearly 30 years this makes about a much sense as General Hospital's Laura forgiving Luke (not to mention marrying him and having kids with him and staying married to him in one way shape or form for over 25 years) after he raped her when she was a teenager. There hasn't been much of anything about this storyline I've liked or could excuse so why should this particular development be any different?
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Post by teachgirl on Aug 11, 2011 15:23:59 GMT -5
I think that's my problem with it, that it doesn't feel like a VL thing to do to me with the way it is told. For one as a show VL sadly has never been all that good about paying attention to detail (and they have even less reason to do that for minor storylines) or about paying attention to the things fans care about (like anniversaries, preserving a couple's special place or song). This is just mind-boggling to me, because for American soaps, this is their bread and butter; a couple's special place, song, anniversary. Right now there is a new head writer on General Hospital who has started to play to at least three different couple fanbases with one storyline. In one scene he alluded symbolically, without the use of flashbacks, to a canonical scene that occurred in 1998 and trusted longtime viewers to make the connection. I'm not saying the VL should be like this soap, and I know that German audiences may have different expectations, but just that I wonder whether playing to different fanbases and paying attention to these details might increase viewer loyalty and therefore ratings. Just wanted to say that I really enjoyed reading this particular exchange of views on how to interpret this conversation between Jessica and Dana because it shows how different viewers can interpret the same evidence in very different ways; each argument is well-supported with evidence from the storyline and knowledge of the show's history. It's why I enjoy this forum.
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Post by chrolliforever7 on Aug 11, 2011 15:24:30 GMT -5
Ur so right, Mitsaso. I'm not nor have I ever been convinced that the threesome happened.
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silviam11
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Post by silviam11 on Aug 11, 2011 15:32:26 GMT -5
Loved your post, Mitsaso! I totally agree with you.
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Post by lolaruns on Aug 11, 2011 15:38:30 GMT -5
But they aren't. Watch any of the other storylines and see what hammering and force-feeding looks like. This isn't it.
Heh, like VL ever cared about this (again look at any other storyline going at the moment, from the months and months of dragging out that Helena ran over Phil, to the endless combinations of characters meeting and finding out about each other in Mallorca). In fact, I would say they relish exactly that.
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