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Post by firecrawler09 on Jun 2, 2011 14:48:19 GMT -5
What I don't understand is the motive behind giving Fervid an absolutely high and happy ending in Season 6, and then turning 180 in this season and giving them a tragic end.
What changed their mind? Apparently there were even plans to marry off David and Fer after the non-wedding for Fer and Borja, so at least until then the writers were comfortable enough to give Fervid (and us) the happy ending that everyone craves for...so why the sudden turn here to the extreme? I just don't understand.
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firens
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Post by firens on Jun 2, 2011 14:54:19 GMT -5
So Javier tonight said he wouldn't describe his character in 76 as a ghost. I am not sure what that means, and what else it could be. But like Shiny, after that videochat, I am more than ever determined to watch Monday's show to find out and see how the couple ends. I think Fer in 7x06 is David's hallucination and the episode is about David coming to terms with Fer's death. This does not make me happy or satisfied in any way. If you look at the preview for 76, it seems clear that in the bits we have with Fer in the room, David doesn't see him. So it could hardly be his "hallucination". I suppose the idea is that Fer although he has been dead and buried for two months is really still there because he loves David and David loves him. And, once again, the episode's title is "I see you". Beyond that, I don't know how it works, but from what Javier said, it appears David does see Fer eventually and they interact. I want to see that.
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jos87
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Post by jos87 on Jun 2, 2011 14:56:00 GMT -5
firens i'm totally agree with you (this is not new ) about everything you said;and i repeat that i don't like the fact that Fer is dead (because i wanted to see.as ferdivista,the marriage between these 2 wonderful guys;because they and us deserve something like this) but i want to wait until the next episode to say if what the writers did with Fer and David is wrong or not. And i'm with firens when he says: And I also want to say that I couldn't disagree more with the notion of "lazy writing" being applied here. If Fer and David had become mythical way before last night, it is precisely to the amazing quality of the writing for their scenes (that never flagged, even when there were weaknesses in the rest of the show), as much as to the amazing talent of both performers, that we owe what FerVid has become the world over. i know that the writers have create something that we don't like,but we can't "destroy" all the work they have done in these years (this is what i think),the fact that they create for us wonderful scenes,thanks too the great talent of Adrian and Javier and their big chemistry (that is due to the great friendship between them;and we can see that when they talk about the other,like Adrian in the video showed today during the videoencuentro or Javier when today talked about Adrian).
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firens
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Post by firens on Jun 2, 2011 15:08:44 GMT -5
What I don't understand is the motive behind giving Fervid an absolutely high and happy ending in Season 6, and then turning 180 in this season and giving them a tragic end. What changed their mind? Apparently there were even plans to marry off David and Fer after the non-wedding for Fer and Borja, so at least until then the writers were comfortable enough to give Fervid (and us) the happy ending that everyone craves for...so why the sudden turn here to the extreme? I just don't understand. Yes, the initial plan was that Season 6 would be the last one for all "old" characters, and thus the exit story for Fer and David would have been their getting married, in the season's finale, probably with all their friends present in a reunion. There would have been no non wedding with Borja because, as Javier clearly said tonight, Fer was never really in love with Borja, Borja was rebound, Fer was too messed up to acknowledge he was still only in love with David. But originally, he would have managed to get his act together much earlier in the season, left Borja, got back with David and married him. Instead it was decided to keep on 4 old characters and Fer and David not only didn't get married but got back together only 10 minutes before the end of Season 6. So that left enough issues unresolved to account for their being in Season 7. Now why the choice of the tragic option? I suppose the writers feel it is entirely consistent with Fer's character that he should end like this, and also that sad endings have a higher emotional force than happy endings. One can disagree with the latter, but it is absolutely not an extravagant or novel idea. The question of David still remains, as I'd said before last night, because of the horrible cruelty of what's happened to him. I'd like to know if originally David was supposed to leave in 76 (for Salamanca?), like Fer. We'll probably never know, since he appears in the following episode, which is also the last ever for the show in its current form. In any event, it will be easier to decide whether one likes the writers' decisions once the whole story has been told, and that's Monday night.
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Shiny
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Medicina alternativa, tu saliva en mi saliva, es f?sica o qu?mica.
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Post by Shiny on Jun 2, 2011 15:22:23 GMT -5
Oh, god... We're going to crying coming Monday again because of highly emotional scene with David. And then the other week because of the FoQ end. Like Javi mentioned today it'll be #hastasiemprefoq. Ok, now I'm just trying to stay strong! Or I'll just go and re-watch videoencuentro with Javi. He was really adorable! I wish I could understand more than 10% of what he's saying
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firens
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Post by firens on Jun 2, 2011 15:24:59 GMT -5
Didn't you like it when he started speaking Spanish with a Russian accent, or at least his impression of one?
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Shiny
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Post by Shiny on Jun 2, 2011 15:28:44 GMT -5
He-he-he.. I don't know what kind of accent that supposed to be May be that's how russians speak Spanish... But that was really funny!! I liked that he pronounced name of our series almost without an accent. And I think he was also making jokes about russian tweets, that sometimes he doesn't understand them at all. And I know now why it happens. Pure google translate
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ari
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Post by ari on Jun 2, 2011 15:34:59 GMT -5
What I don't understand is the motive behind giving Fervid an absolutely high and happy ending in Season 6, and then turning 180 in this season and giving them a tragic end. What changed their mind? Apparently there were even plans to marry off David and Fer after the non-wedding for Fer and Borja, so at least until then the writers were comfortable enough to give Fervid (and us) the happy ending that everyone craves for...so why the sudden turn here to the extreme? I just don't understand. Because they're writers, and that's what some writers do. They want to be "creative" and they probably think that this crap they're writing is a masterpiece. Some may believe that it is, and I'm sure many won't. They have a right to do as they wish, I just think that sometimes simple is better than convolution. The fact remains that Fer is dead. This is a drama about students and staff at a school. Simple. The drama doesn't need to go to a different level than that like some convoluted "he's the love of his life" and will be forever, he will be his light, he will see" crap. They're just two young men dealing with life, love and school. Simple, or it was.
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firens
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Post by firens on Jun 2, 2011 15:59:33 GMT -5
He-he-he.. I don't know what kind of accent that supposed to be May be that's how russians speak Spanish... But that was really funny!! I liked that he pronounced name of our series almost without an accent. And I think he was also making jokes about russian tweets, that sometimes he doesn't understand them at all. And I know now why it happens. Pure google translate That's exactly what he said ;D
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Post by ashesborn on Jun 2, 2011 16:10:59 GMT -5
Or I'll just go and re-watch videoencuentro with Javi. He was really adorable! I wish I could understand more than 10% of what he's saying Where can I watch it?
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firens
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Post by firens on Jun 2, 2011 16:18:53 GMT -5
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Post by firecrawler09 on Jun 2, 2011 17:44:28 GMT -5
Thank you for the reference, I don't know the show ( Xena, I mean) except as a title, but it's most probably relevant because Ruano, at least, seems to be a big horro/fantasy geek. (In that sense, possible references to Buffy might also work). So that it's clear, I am not, and, as a rule, I loathe the supernatural. It's probably because I'm French ;D. But there are exceptions, of course. One of them is the Portuguese film I mentioned last night, Odete. The other one is the Japanese classic, . Both are about love haunting. There was some of it too in Honoré's Les Chansons d'amour, which is also a gay movie, but the articulation of the haunting to the gay love story was very different there. All this to say that there are models for what we are about to see.Speaking of this, I can't believe I just remembered now, but has anyone here seen A Single Man? It's a fantastic movie that came out 2 years ago starring Colin Firth and Matthew Goode. It's also a gay movie dealing with haunting. Actually at the beginning of the movie, Matthew's character is already dead and we spend the rest of the film with Colin's character reminiscing about his past with his lover for the last 15 years. He plans on killing himself on that day since he can't bear with the pain anymore (Matthew's character has been dead for 8 months) and just as he met someone who could potentially turn his life around and give him another reason to live, he succumbs at the end of the movie (not by suicide though). I feel that the upcoming episode for Fervid could be making a tribute for that movie as well, since it's quite popular in the LGBT community and is a great movie overall. I'm not saying David will die, but the whole haunting and surrealistic style of the movie could be adapted for the episode. Here's the first part of the movie for those curious (English with Spanish subtitles): www.youtube.com/watch?v=BiibsktNNXE
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Post by antisen on Jun 2, 2011 22:25:24 GMT -5
I had intended to make some comments on the actual shoot out, so here they are.
Okay, so this was an obvious inspiration from the Columbine High School massacre.
One seriously issue I had throughout the entire shooting scene was how there were only that handful of students in the school, all of which never ended up getting shot. The Columbine event had many people being shot or randomly shot at, and even a teacher died. Their deaths, was said to be due to religious and social standings, where the killers would ask them if they believed in god or if they were popular students.
Comparing FoQ's shooting to what happened in Grey's Anatomy (where if you watch it, it might really send chills down your spine because the killer was actually killing people at every level of the hospital, when his objective was to kill a specific doctor), it makes it even clear that FoQ's spin on it was really sub par, and the only thing that made it big was Fer's death (of which we can see how much focus and tears are on that subject... but there is little associated to his shooter, or the scene in which he got shot. Because it wasn't that great.)
Also, the biggest silly event throughout that episode was when Tono chained up the doors, in broad daylight. It doesn't make sense to me how no one saw that, or even heard that, since for seven seasons now, we have seen a constant stream of students all the time...
And how difficult is it for a SWAT team, no less, to break in to the school? We already saw one or two stationed at the back door, and they weren't entering for some reason or another. If they were taking in to account that Tono might have freaked out if the police were to break in... there was no communication between the two parties.
I think Fer's death might have been easier to swallow if he wasn't the only causality (nobody cares about Veronica, so... then again she didn't die...).
It's like how they say that a single death is a tragedy, multiple death's is a statistic. Plus Fer specifically died because he was the only one who put himself out there without backing out (Daniella tried but backed out it seems), and would have succeeded if it wasn't for the panic that Tono ended up succumbing to when Alvaro decided to ambush him.
Which is why I can understand the injustice of this matter. That someone who didn't deserve death ended up dying.
I would like to see any element of David blaming Alavaro or Jon for Fer's death. It might at least give fans some closure that the people who were being jackasses and bullying people got to at least live with some guilt (which is why I guess Alvaro is now going crazy?).
Anyway, it just would've been nice (sick I know...) if they ended up killing more people. To me, it follows the concept of "if you want to do it, might as well do it right" and not just end up killing one specific character. to kill off Fer.
I just feel that the writers gained inspiration from such a serious event to engineer Fer's death. These school shootings are a big issue that has induced fear and sorrow on so many parents and students. So it's definitely something that I feel angry about. Especially with how they spinned it off.
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pepsi
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Post by pepsi on Jun 3, 2011 8:38:52 GMT -5
Hi!
I put 2 videos for ad chapter 76 in Antena3 in spoiler section.
It seems more confortable and logic than the previus of the chapter 75, that camouflaged all the pain of fer death in chapter 76, in the previus we only see David trying to forget fer, Yoli harassing david for her obsession with Fer death, and it seems as all people forgets fer... but in the ads we can see all the people pain 2 month later, David and yoli crying in a grass place? may be graveyard??? alvaro not forgive himself and he's disturbed and antisocial, as Jon, blame and hatred of them by their peers, etc...
Perhaps Fer will have his final tribute and farewell as he deserves for all he shows and meaning for others, for people who have loved and lived with him things, sense emotions, suffering, love and happy with him, and for the fans and actors, who deserve it. (as J. Vaca and Javi calvo anticipate)... as the show negate it in chapter 75, maybe it will be in 76.... I think I will cry again Monday...
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jos87
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Post by jos87 on Jun 3, 2011 9:49:31 GMT -5
Perhaps Fer will have his final tribute and farewell as he deserves for all he shows and meaning for others, for people who have loved and lived with him things, sense emotions, suffering, love and happy with him, and for the fans and actors, who deserve it. (as J. Vaca and Javi calvo anticipate)... as the show negate it in chapter 75, maybe it will be in 76.... I think I will cry again Monday... i think the same;and i'm sure we'll cry a lot next Monday (and i believe too in the last scene of the last episode because we'll have a reference to Fer[maybe someone will read the same speech that Fer read in the first chapter of FoQ]).I'm ready to cry.
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jos87
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Post by jos87 on Jun 3, 2011 11:59:48 GMT -5
so from the advance we can see Yoli talking to Fer;maybe he is only Yoli's imagination.But we know that at the end of the chapter we'll have the real "despedida" between Fer and David;so maybe David after all we'll be able to see Fer for the last time (and from the promo of Antena 3 seems that David sees Fer walking)
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Liana
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Post by Liana on Jun 3, 2011 12:14:24 GMT -5
Um.... dumb question from the peanut gallery... is the next ep the last episode ever? Or is there one more after that
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Shiny
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Medicina alternativa, tu saliva en mi saliva, es f?sica o qu?mica.
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Post by Shiny on Jun 3, 2011 13:04:04 GMT -5
There will be 2 more episodes - 76 on coming Monday and 77 on 13.June
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firens
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Post by firens on Jun 3, 2011 14:34:54 GMT -5
antisenI generally agree with your remarks. When we were wondering which big tragedy that had made international news could be made to happen in the Zurbarán (after Andrea Duro's interview came out), I had pointed out that of course Columbine was an obvious choice (or, unfortunately, any other in the long list of school or college campus massacres), but it also was a risky choice: there has never been such an event in Spain (meaning that if or when something like that finally comes to pass, the show will be blamed and the writers crucified for it), and as you justly say, when you take up something like this, you gotta do it right, and it is difficult. Difficult because this is a teen show and a dramedy, so there are limits (tacit or explicit, I don't know) about what you can show, how much violence, etc... And so how many deaths as well, I guess. One interesting thing about this using American events and narratives is that adapting them to Spanish realities implies a change in scale. The two killers at Columbine had no problem acquiring semi-automatic weapons, an authentic arsenal, not to mention explosive devices. Here we have a kid who steals his (absent) father's hunting rifle, a weapon that causes ugly damage but is as unlikely a choice as they come if one is thinking of going on a rampage. Re the blocking of exits, I found it interesting that in the one precedent to this on the show, Erica's attempt at the end of Season 3, there was much more emphasis on how well-planned the attack was. Here, it's clearly spur of the moment, which explains as well the strange ineffectiveness of Toño, not just when it comes to actually killing people, whether they are his targets or not, but also to force open the door of the boys' dressing-room. But this lack of casualties, until the end, has to be balanced with what I felt was the accuracy of a number of psychological moments, like when Toño almost shoots the barmaid of the coffee shop. Also remarkable in my view, the use of the comic moments of Olimpia and Enrique, looking for Frida, Enrique's bitch. It's not just for the sake of relief, it's to keep the audience lulled until the absurd and unexpected tragedy occurs. So yeah, it's true that all this serves the sole purpose of bringing about the death of that one character. It makes it clear it's a catastrophic death. A death that occurs when everything seemed to have been solved by that character's courage and generosity. So the sense of not just absurdity but radical unfairness has to be overwhelming. It's not just the fact that only one dies that makes it a tragedy, it's the fact that it is the best one.
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Liana
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Post by Liana on Jun 3, 2011 16:45:31 GMT -5
I wanna see Julio's reaction to Fer's death... I'm sure it would devastate him. Unless something happens to him later that I don't know about cuz I'm in the middle of season 5 & I don't see Julio that much in the Fer/David scenes but when I do he looks scary.
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Post by Duskysoda on Jun 5, 2011 0:41:46 GMT -5
Has FOQ ever shown a sex scene between David and Fer that matches hetero sex scenes on the show? I don't recall any that match say Roman and Ruth going at it for example
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Post by dots80 on Jun 5, 2011 8:14:27 GMT -5
not to my knowledge. For a couple that became the IT couple of a series they really didn't have many intimate scenes.
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jos87
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Post by jos87 on Jun 5, 2011 8:41:35 GMT -5
I don't think that Adrian and Javier have problem to shoot intimate scenes (even if i believe that a sex-scene like Ruth-Roman'one in the season 6 could be embarrassing to play for them) but the fact is that the audience of FoQ is not only formed by Fervidistas;there are other people too that can find nice Fer and David as couple but that can't appreciate some kind of scenes (like gay sex-intimate scenes);Antena 3 must think to these people too.While to see straight-sex scenes is not a "problem" for all the people who watch FoQ (i don't think that the gay fans of FoQ have a problem to see a man having sex with a woman).And the fact that the writers and the actor have no problem to do this intimate scenes can be seen for example in the advance of 7x05 where there is the scene in the art-class with a part that wasn't showed on antena 3,because we can see a passionate kiss between Fer and David while they are "topless",that in the final edit was cut;and i think that was Antena 3 to do this for the reason i explained previously.(and please don't say,like i read in a spanish forum, that Antena 3 is homophobic;ok that is more closer to the right-wing but if A3 was homophobic i don't think that they would permit to have a gay couple as protagonist of one of their show;and i don't think that they would aired these days a Fervid video of 2 minutes as Tv promo for the next episode).However for me it doesn't matter if we haven't seen intimate scenes;ok i'd like to see Fervid in that kind of scene but the power of Fervid is strong without intimate scenes too.
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Post by Duskysoda on Jun 5, 2011 12:35:54 GMT -5
thats fine... it matters to me that we didn't see it... A3 is just saying they are scared of showing intimate scenes between Men that are on a par with opposite sex couples on FOQ... To me that is cowardly and they should be condemned for it and I do so now. FOQ....You are condemned.
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jos87
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Post by jos87 on Jun 5, 2011 12:56:40 GMT -5
Am I condemned? i dont' know if smile or not after this However what change in the wonderful Fervid's story the presence or not of sex-scenes? nothing for me (even i'd like to see this intimate scenes;but i can survive). And saying to A3 that is coward is not fair;we have to thank A3 and FoQ's stuff to give us this wonderful story for more than 2 years (with Fervid becoming an A-story in these last 2 season);Antena 3 is a channel television whose audience is not only formed by gay people;so they have to care about all the audiance and not of a part of it;and today in our society there is a part of the people that have problem to see 2 men having sex;so i can understand if is Antena 3 to cut this kind of scene (always if is antena 3 to do this);and i have said that for me Adrian and Javier have no problems to shoot this kind of scenes,but maybe i'm wrong and they are embarrased to shoot something like this:And don't say to me that if this is the truth then Adrian and Javier are not good actors,because we know that they are great. So i think that we have to be content for what we had.People are never satisfied.
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