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Post by stregatta on Feb 10, 2012 13:25:14 GMT -5
Probably it also goes down to the fact you're a girl?! probably not on a rational level but (also as you told, thanks to the many macho-action movies men-versus-men) deep down it's perceived as less dangerous somehow (since usually girls & children are physically weaker, hence morally "double wrong")... I've to say instead (even from a woman's perspective), I've found it regardless very disturbing to watch, & generally speaking I don't think people took it so well the thing either: especially since Ste overall never responded to the violence directly (apart that only infamous baseball bat-sequence I mean...a bit of slack had been cut because Ste was an abuser before as well, therefore I guess fans along with him, waited to see if also BB might change or not). On another thread instead I've found this comment from an ex HO "insider", here's a part: "...the pacing of Hollyoaks' stories is unequal. The production company doesn't have the resources of the people that produce EastEnders or Coronation Street or Emmerdale on the majority British channels. As a result, it has to stretch out its storylines according to script-writing and filming talent available at the time. It doesn't have enough of a production crew to create four or five storylines all at the same time and then stitch them together at the same kind of speed that the bigger soaps have. Sometimes, this works to Hollyoaks' benefit." I know what you intend by saying that, naturally sometimes I'm bothered too of having to wait a longer period to see the conclusion of some plot, anyway I mostly agree with the other guy: since the pace is slower it kinda feel a bit more realistically believable, I even prefer not to see every little detail or people marry/divorce 100 times around like in American soaps, this way it feels more as a series to me than a cartoon, once you've made the habit...
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Post by stregatta on Feb 6, 2012 18:05:42 GMT -5
Totally agree with you Rosemonday! (plus others ), Stendan won't ever be a conventional couple & besides this is also what we enjoy of them, moreover it's true HO has lost a good opportunity to see them growing into a strong even if dysfunctional duo, instead of "wasting" these months with an anti-climax, but frankly I believe the situation is even simpler than that...it's because HO was afraid of losing another badass character (after Danny, Silas & Warren) therefore knowing how popular BB was, decided for that period to drag on the love-story in favour of the single characters' "development" (I guess they'll show more of Ste from now on too), I guess they were scared to lose the momentum, plus there had been a change of writers/producers too. _BTW now that the whole game is changed, I hope that for the future they won't be as scared as before "to jump the shark" & go there exploring Stendan also as a couple, in fact since they're interesting & different from each other roles, I don't think anyone will get bored watching them also the other way round, we've had enough of drama & violence...besides for those telling fans of Brendan are crazy or not realizing how bad Ste was in that situation, well I guess nobody is a sadistic at all, simply Emmet played that role so well, as a 3-D character who is still developing, not a plain bastard villain like Hannibal Lecter could have been, that got people interested even in rooting for him as the antihero. That said surely also Steven has to grow stronger & stop being the victim to move on the plot: I'm positive nobody wanted to see him suffering because only BB was important into fans' view & has got a sort of free pass every time. Furthermore the audience should also remember that perhaps Ste, coming from a personal story of domestic abuse & issues (like his own violence) cut BB (too much) slack because he had an idea of what he was feeling, giving him the chance to change. I'm with you saying that that last scene with Ste reminding him he had lost all hopes on him, had been even more powerful than going to the Police... _To Anthony & people talking of racism on Noah's role honestly I think was more a matter of fans at the time too involved with Stendan only to even consider at that point another possible triangle (even if unfortunately it's true that sometimes also the skin can play a big part in television's choices). Nowadays it seems a bit different: fans aren't anymore in the heat of the moment with Stendan, I think even the most hardcore fan needs a break after months of angst, slaps & fists...so virtually more comfortable accepting a new wannabe BF for Steven (white or whatever I mean doesn't matter). Naturally to see if he can truly act we need time, but as far as I've seen he's charming & promising; personally I hope this time BB will manage to open his eyes & cure himself before it's too late to go back...if this won't be the case (we never know, even if this STALLY new couple will have many fans etc) I guess Ste was right after all, BB doesn't know how to love anyone! _I'm liking George & Callum a lot unexpectedly, I'm glad HO tries to face delicate social issues, kudos ...however I agree with this fan's comment found: "Callum is a catch all right and I'd be fine as many people here with them staying friends but I'd hate it if the writers would go down that route, of George falling for Callum first. Always the puppy-faced vulnerable gays falling for the straight and unattainable adonis, ugh spare me. Let George have the upper hand? on this if this pairing has even a future. If anything, Callum would be the one falling for him first". I bet my 2 cents there's chemestry between these 2 apparently so distant characters, but I hope it won't be the usual stereotype, with George as the feminine type while Callum the macho-man...please! Fingers crossed for something more subtle then (perhaps Callum bisex?! )
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Post by stregatta on Jun 29, 2010 13:04:07 GMT -5
BONO, I was simply adding my POV, I'm not "angry", I was pointing out to MD & other people around internet, who seemed to take it as a truth, that Reid's death isn't a spoiler at all! Especially after what I've previously written, there were already other fans worried about other 2 bad rumours always about this bad fate... In this sense I've written that comment: also because in my POV, Noah, Reid & especially Luke of course, will have their happy ending, no need to be sad at all!! Therefore, my comment had nothing to do with the fact that I like Reid's role: yes,I also hope that Noah will go away for a period for real, but it's for the plot's sake, otherwise, I couldn't see Lure's couple together, while about Nuke we already know their dynamic. PS_Priviet T.!! & PIXIE,...I'm sux curious too!!
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Post by stregatta on Jun 29, 2010 12:43:27 GMT -5
I'm among those who thought between Lure there were moe than "feelings/ attraction" since quite a lot of time now : but it's something that wasn't shown openly, hence all the right debate... Probably if it were a not-American show, what I've seen up to now, could be perfect to assume a love-story is surely coming along (& I still hope it'll be this way, of course!), but being a US-1, where all has to be declared out loud to be true, obviously TPTB could do whatever they want, despite logical POVs, until close to the ending line... We'll see where they want us to go by now that the cards seem to be down on the table!
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Post by stregatta on Jun 26, 2010 12:36:19 GMT -5
So now that it's been all but confirmed that Reid is killed off I gotta say I feel a mix of emotions. But I think it's mostly sadness, I'm just sad... I just don't understand why do it? What does it accomplish? It doesn't even bring Nuke together so it seems pointless Why couldn't they let Reid exit the show alive even if unhappy. Or better - satisafactory ending for all the characters? I'm just so sick of gay characters always ending on unhappy note... I'm sure that both Noah fans and Luke fans can be somewhat happy with what they get - but me, being predominantly a fan of Reid - I can't find anything positive in all this Your completely right but I'm a Nuke fan but It pisses me off that Reid dies. They couldn't kick their new golden boy to the curb for a Nuke reunion so they kill him off. It's a cop out. They didn't want to make a decision per say, so they kill him off and give us fleeting hope that Nuke will get back together in future. Not only was it done already in Hollyoaks but it was hugely hated by virtually everyone. I think the writing for the gay characters on TV is appalling but that's another post. I think what pisses me off more is a 54 year old soap with a rich history will basically end up with Reid dying in the end, in one of the shows last storylines. A newbie who in sept will be on the show for 8 months basically ends the show with a huge storyline. Nothing against Reid (I'd be complaining about it if it was Gabriel) but the ending hours and weeks of the show should have been spent on the veterans of the show. With everything being siad. We don't know the rest of the story. Who kills him? Does Nuke's relationship rekindle again like Craig and JP's did before Keiron was killed? Apart from the fact I don't think you would cry if actually Reid is axed from the SL...Please everyone, don't spread fake rumours as if they were true! It's not fair to any of the fans I believe; & BTW, I'd never wish the death of Noah, even if I'm not a fan, it's not classy at all -removed bolded text.
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Post by stregatta on Jun 23, 2010 18:51:36 GMT -5
The acting in the episode really was great. It was some of the best work that Eric, Van and Jake have done, and this is coming from someone who thinks that Jake's acting ability has contributed to some of the problems of previous storylines. Jake was able to show that Noah is hurting, and that he still cares for Luke, but that he doesn't know what to do. I think the foundation was laid today for the triangle, and for it to be believable. Totally agree with you!!
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Post by stregatta on Jun 23, 2010 18:50:37 GMT -5
Regardless all this endless drama/ angst of last period, I'm totally in love with this duo...Lure's mirrored scenes are great, like this last heartwrenching 1 from last ep! Good to see Noah finally coming to his reason again..Now I'm just hoping from a little happiness from Lure, I need to see something pleasant for a change too...
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Post by stregatta on Jun 16, 2010 17:32:14 GMT -5
Here's a direct transcription that someone did of what Reid said to Noah and what Noah said to Luke: Reid : It's a deal breaker. Keep Mr. Snyder out of my orbit. Deal Noah: Yeah it's a deal. Then: Noah to Luke: Dr. Oliver doesn't want you around him at all. Ever. Meaning we have to stay away from each other starting right now. He won't perform the surgery if I don't stay away from you. I told him I'm OK with it. I'm not sure how Noah got confused about what Reid said, but it was clearly not that he has to stay away from Luke. The scene that's mentioned a few posts up is obviously about Luke being in the shop, while Reid is also there. Noah just flat out didn't want to be around Luke. Also, Luke has been a lot more mature around Reid. We've seen him doing a lot with the new hospital wing, which is tied to the foundation, so the work angle has not been dropped. But, aside from that, we've seen him stand up for himself when he's around Reid, that usually never happens when he's with Noah. That alone is a huge step in the right direction. I agree with your POV & besides, it seems to me that Luke around Reid had had also that needed "push" towards his ideal job (I guess it's "helping people through the foundation" ), a thing that fans always had complained about, his lacking or losing a working aim in life, since Noah came along...
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Post by stregatta on Jun 11, 2010 20:15:44 GMT -5
Luke is growing a little, even though the end of the last episode could be seen as a step backward. It was never explained why he did it, but it was a grownup move to take that seat on the hospital board. He could have just donated the money, but he actually has a say in how the new wing is built, plus he has his job at Damien's company. And I don't think the old Luke would have ever been so honest with Noah, like Luke was on the hospital roof, and in Java this past Wednesday. Reid has also changed, he's shown more compassion, and I think he's trying to be the guy that he thinks Luke wants him to be. That could be a good or bad thing. The storyline will always be focused on Luke's point of view, so even though it sucks, I really don't expect them to spend too much time, if any at all, showing that Noah is changing or growing up. I agree with your POV & disagree with Mona & Md's ones. Even Luke now seems to have found his place at work, obviously we haven't been able to see much of it, because the show now is focused on the new relationship & Noah's blindness in the recent past took away lots of time to other things, BTW I guess writers are setting Luke as an important add to the hospital...So perhaps we'll have Reid & Luke as the future Bob & Kim!
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Post by stregatta on Jun 11, 2010 11:14:28 GMT -5
Based on the promo, either Reid has decided to fight Bob's ultimatum, or he's decided to make Bob think that he picked his job over Luke, but he plans on keeping his relationship with Luke a secret. If the second scenario is true, that seems really out of character for Reid. I don't think that he would lie to Bob, and he is too direct and upfront with people to hide his relationship, or lie about this. I can see a secret relationship causing a lot of stress and problems for Luke and Reid, but it would be ammunition for Noah when he comes back. Thanks for the promo-clip! Anyway I guess as usual being a short piece of the speech, probably Luke will be upset (like spoilers told) because after meeting Reid for an official board's meeting, it'll already known about "how to behave" according to Bob...So he questions Reid about it, & probably we could have some surprise comiing from him: wither Reid will use this ultimatum to push Luke to open up to him, or else he will say his reasons for having agree with Bob's order ... Overall, I see good stuff coming along & finally a major turn in the SL. PS_Besides, ESS looks SO FINE with that suit & tie!!
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Post by stregatta on Jun 8, 2010 16:53:48 GMT -5
Yep i agree with José & Cheerios both: for me it does make sense, & even this whole situation will help push finally the envelope of their new relationship; as far as Noah, I won't say more because it's too soon, we've to wait at least to see how he will go away from Oakdale & the terms of his return...
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Post by stregatta on Jun 3, 2010 11:34:31 GMT -5
Maybe that's just me, but I don't like talking about other people's relationships...that aren't fictional. Unless they ask for my help or opinion it's none of my business and discussing that opinion with someone else is just too akin to juvenile gossiping to me. I think it's one thing when that relationship involves me, but if it doesn't I do my best to keep my opinions to myself. And family gossip can be the worst hurtful kind too, considering how important those opinions often are to you. There are so many other things, important or fun, to talk about. I'm also sort of assuming the Lily/Holden chatter isn't just idle chatter, that it's a bit more invasive than it needs to be. I guess it's because Noah was like part of Snyder's family, for all the times they've helped him...& dear mummy Lily isn't able to let Noah go...Hopefully Noah will do the best choices for himself & Luke too, not always having to deal with family business, but for his own this time!
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Post by stregatta on Jun 2, 2010 14:43:19 GMT -5
Where's the party?! Uhhh...It will be great fun indeed tomorrow!! ^_^
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Post by stregatta on Jun 2, 2010 9:53:24 GMT -5
MD, you've written your POV & it's ok, of course it's all fictional, but this doesn't mean that another can't have an opinion about it. I've never said that it's all Noah's fault, as I don't see the same way as you do about what's Reid has done to Nuke's love, when ha was still Noah's doc. 1st of all to make any kind of romantic move (& till the very end, he has tried to push Luke into Noah's arms again), he waited to listen from Luke, at least 2 or 3 times, that he had broken up with Noah. & overall, remember they were not married, as your ex. from Y&R soap. I can't understand because we've to argue most of the times , if a group of fans find "Romeo&Juliet"_Nuke boring, & the other exciting the "I hate that I love you"_Lure dynamic...At each 1 is own, let's enjoy what we've got, & hopefully, writers will let the best story win.
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Post by stregatta on May 31, 2010 21:25:50 GMT -5
INKIE...I can so understand you!! Here every1 loves the hot Doc, at least for his honesty & striaght behaviour....I so hope Luke will have a great way to make amends with him!!! Better for him "the confused villain" of the game...
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Post by stregatta on May 31, 2010 12:50:09 GMT -5
I've never seen a character so bipolar like this Noah...I really can't get or symphatize with him: it's a real pity writers don't use better this role, at his full potential. In another fiction, I remember the creator saying "We've chosen this actor/role, to make fans see that this other character had chosen a person belieavable to stay with, compared to what they were used to see in the whole series...Not a random person, because we care about the details" etc... Here instead it has been all "rushed or missed out" in a bad way IMO! I'm glad to listen on Thrsday what's up MD, it should be interesting & probably we'll understand some more about Noah's reasons
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Post by stregatta on May 31, 2010 9:20:47 GMT -5
BTW, even if it's the only thing all fans agree with, I've the feeling that we won't know lots more regarding Noah, & another thing is that all Noah's fans keep saying that it's because of this mad dad etc, but I remember well when he arrived in town, & if you all wouldn't tell me about he was supposed to be an uptight character, I had had the impression that generally he wasn't so brooding with people (in this sense Reid seems to me more tough & anti-social with every1), with Maddie he had been for inst. so pleasant & all...So why the hell he "changed" so much afterwards? Who knows... However, even if every1 is round & round the word "Love" , I still think there's a distinction: Luke sooner or later will have to choose, because 1 thing is to still care for your 1st love (or really love him forever & ever), another thing is to fall in love with another person. Today we'll hopefully see a little more, an hint. I BTW I mean, whoever will remain in the picture at the end!
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Post by stregatta on May 30, 2010 13:23:41 GMT -5
On TvGuide.ca, you can find a brand new interview with Van Hansis (a link within the site) about the buzz generated by the love triangle & more...
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Post by stregatta on May 30, 2010 13:21:56 GMT -5
AMEN Doroty!! ^_^ But not all fans think alike anyway, or simply someone finds very unpleasant ESS & Dr O. role...
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Post by stregatta on May 30, 2010 12:34:20 GMT -5
CAITLINP I really see where you point comes from, but unfortunately for us viewers, sometimes I've got the impression that behind there's not a strong logic, so for inst., even iif Noah back in the days, brought up that strange speech to Luke "You can date whoever you want to", & then this Richard popped out, it wouldn't by force meaning that Noah was dating this guy, even if, me included, have had that feeling, BUT, as some other fans previously wrote here, it's all about what writers want us to believe.
If tomorrow in the future Noah will come back telling a total reverse story, we've to agree, because "it's in the script"...Obviously I still have hope instead to watch a plausible plot!!
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Post by stregatta on May 30, 2010 12:18:13 GMT -5
And your argument over LuRe is tainted by the fact that LuRe doesn't need propping up. The reason I want Noah around is for development in his own right without regard to LuRe. Did Molly or Lily leave during their triangle? How about Janet or Carley? So why is Noah? The only good reason I can come up with is nobody would believe that Luke would choose Reid over Noah. If Noah stayed and fought for Luke, then Reid wouldn't have a chance in hell. Seroiusly MD, are you kidding?? Just because I assume you root for Noah, Reid won't have a chance?! Com'on please, unless you don't want to believe it's all already written from the start, I don't think so at all. Besides, if we've so many issues trying to understand where Noah's heart & thoughts really are, I guess it's a bad combination of writing+actor+lacking of screen time...But of course not all fans think like me, & it's ok; others are ok with this role anyway, so I don't see why writers should even bother to picture Noah in a different way. BTW, what do you think about Monady's ep? Noah will discover & interrupt the kiss?? I guess he'll ask Richard-dog to take him elsewhere, then will telephone Luke to meet at the bar, faking his blindness... & surprise! Probably Reid will join after & they all will confront each other...
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Post by stregatta on May 30, 2010 7:38:20 GMT -5
JJOSE'...As I've already said, sometimes there are children actors whose skill is brilliant, so I won't tell it's all because JS is younger & less experienced towards others: younger or older, I notice (of course it's always MY personal take & feeling on all) when an actress, like for inst. Lucinda's 1, really gives me "something" or not, even if it's just a guest-star or else, it's like a song, even if you're not a musician, you know if you like it or not. That said, again, I don't think we'll see great changes here: however I don't think Noah will be out of town for so long, it will be like in the past, probably it's just becuase of his kind of contract that he's often off-screen; but a thing is sure, with the blindness issue he should have been able to bring a different kind of emphaty with the audience, that I've never seen (even in this last scene with Dr O, when he pushed him to tell when his sight would have been fully restored: it's not ok that I've felt more emphaty for Reid's lovely manners, than him, because he seemed "bossy" ) Ok, stop talking about this role actor, 'cause it's the wrong thread here, moreover it's pointless, uh?! Let's enjoy what's left for the future...
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Post by stregatta on May 30, 2010 5:44:50 GMT -5
I have seen enough of Jake to judge. He plays it according to the text of the script. And, a great actor, even with a bad script, can elevate the material if he's truly great. There are alot off quite bad movies that we remember due to the performances of great actors, but if you read it in script form you would say "how could I ever liked that movie?" I am not making an excuse for the writers. THe fact is everyone else works with the same writers. The guy who plays Luke performed better even when he was given crappy story lines to work from. As a closing note, I think about the scene with Richard that Noah had. What made the scene not work for me was not only what was said but how it was said. There are emotional cues the actor could have used to convey a rather complex past that were not on the page as written but still would have made us , the audience, feel like we got it. A pause here. A moment there. A tone there. An unexpected smill when one is nervous. Even putting on the water works when he was talking. They are acting choices, and they can make a lot of difference. I haven't seen Jake in anything else, so I don't know if he's capable of giving a great performance. I do know that I've seen excellent actors end up giving mediocre performances due to bad writing, directing, and editing. All of which ATWT has repeatedly demonstrated. So, take that for whatever it's worth. As for why Noah/Jake are off screen for some period of time ... who knows? But the only reason I can think of that LuRe could need "propping up" would be if the relationship is too weak to survive on its own merits. I don't see that at this point. I guess we'll see what "Noah's return has Luke in turmoil" means as far as the strength of LuRe goes. As far as Noah's development, I also would like to see it happen on-screen. But, him going away does kind of seem like a plot device to bring back a changed man. I guess we'll see on that, too. Obviously I can't judge from a director POV SHAMEL., & I don't want to always criticize, it's simply IMO, but you really have a point here... I guess lots of viewers didn't feel the emotion going through screen with at least this part played by JS, matched with the weird plot material: the last vindow_Peeping Tom_scene didn't work so well either, I was even annoyed that the camara turned towards him, stealing a pathos scene from the other 2 (I swear it wasn't just x the !). It didn't hit me, I couldn't understand if he was just sad or angry/ hurt...With Richard I didn't like that the director didn't give so much focus on the new boy, but just on Noah, so again I've the doubt of what I should have exactly taken from that context?! But also in the past, I remember the reaction to mad dad shooting Luke, he wasn't convincing, & of course the scene of the window, a sort of "trademark" of ATWT since nowadays, worked instead well few time ago with ESS. Apart from the script, he succeeds in making the audience feel the same as his role through his acting. Perhaps we'll be luckier with the PUNCH-scene: Jake is better when he gets physical! ***Ok, now back to SPOILERS*** I've read here & there that "the LOVE" sentence that Luke is going to say soon, could have been told out of guilt & for nostalgia for Noah's past: of course the tie-looking, remembering their 1st kiss was a clear clue of memories not yet dead...Hence some1 thinks for Reid Luke feels just sexual attraction, for Noah, especially after his coming back, the TRUE love... I guess instead obviously he's a mixed feeling inside right now, but we'll see growing his love for Reid until he'll realize it clearly, & for Noah has a kind of different love, inherited from the past; but I don't think, like other Lure-fans, that when he'll say LOVE for Noah, intended "not IN l. but simply l.": it's clear that right now he still feels attached to his ex, with whom, even after 4 break-ups, he seems always not able to really burn bridges with him. PS_S., don't you find ironic that JS was the 1 said to be even "more" compared to others, because he used "to teach" the colleagues how to do a scene, because he's also a director?!
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Post by stregatta on May 29, 2010 20:19:17 GMT -5
SHAMELESS, I completely agree with you, you know...But after seeing how TPTB play with Noah's role (& the skill of this actor too), I've no faith left in what you hope (& unfortunately I know because it's happened so many times before with other stuff, not just AI)...
I bet my 2 cents, are you used to say, about not seeing more incredible changes/ awakenings in characters, but simply a development of what we've already seen.
To sum up in few words, if the writers, despite the possible good SL & the rest, want to make Nuke as endgame, they will simply make coming home at a point the same old Noah, & making him re-discovering his feelings for Luke, & vice versa, in the usual pointless way, without an actual growth within the characters, all based on the old Romeo&Juliet_fable.
Frankly, we think that they should explain us MORE, but actually they are not obliged to, in Soapland it's all fictional...Like their feelings, that change like the seasons! ^_^
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Post by stregatta on May 29, 2010 20:03:30 GMT -5
Hello guys, It has been a long time since I've watched "ATWT" (yes, since that Amira mess, I gave up on this show) and god, I guess I missed out a lot. I must say this Dr. Reid guy is really making me excited. I like how the writers portrayed him. He's unapologetic, firm and confident but yet there is this flaw, this vulnerability that makes him attractive. It's like a breath of fresh air for TV soap's characters. And I like that. And I find it amusing that there are so many people rooting for Luke and Reid. It's usually the other way round when a third character was introduced to a gay love story. People normally disliked the 3rd party. This clearly shows that the writers have turned Noah from a likable character to such an unlikable one. But also it's great to know another 4th gay character in being introduced. I wonder what brought this change. A sudden influx of gay characters. It's like the writers and the producers of the show are ignoring what people are going to say and just go ahead with whatever they since the show is going to end soon. It's funny how the story is getting better now as compared to a few years ago. Welcome back HARMONIUM! I guess you've chosen the perfect time to join again the show...& yes, perhaps nowadays writers are feeling freer to create what they really wanted to, before I had this impression that (as for another couple in EU, Chrolli of VL), they felt "obliged" to go for a sure path with the gay-characters (apart from US conservative sex-issue...): as to say, making them lovey-dovey, never breaking them up, the sure happy-end & blah blah.... Obviously doing this, killing off the real drama & essence of a plot, but you know, being 1 of the 1st plots of this kind made, probably they were walking on eggs...Now it seems to be very different, & it's not suffice anymore to have a random boring SL, with gays in it, but a great 1 on a 1st place, & moreover in 2nd place, a good characterization of gays, as every other 3 dimensional role made before for straight people. At this stage I'm also curious to see if they're brave enough to show a sex scene between Lure, more "realistic" than the lacking of Nuke's 1s in the past, like they've always done for hetero couples: that could be a very distincitive sign of a real change... About the 4th...Richard, who literally knows?! It's so random the use they've done of him, but I guess he could be important for Noah's character, if not they wouldn't take him back in this eps, with that weird speech made by Noah... IMO obviously I'm also glad to see this passion around for Lure , but having followed Reid's role from the start I understand WHY: writers until now are all for him, & left just the crumbs for Noah's role, hence people instead of caring for him, are simply fed up...
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