Critical discussion / spoilers allowed

[sheepiefarm]

Feeling frustrated, disappointed, angry or upset at storylines or characters.
Feel free to discuss it here.

[sheepiefarm]

I am aware that I come across as a Jackson hater in most of my posts.
In all honesty, I actually like his character.
What I haven't liked is the way his character has been used.

I guessed way back in June at just where they were gonna go with his inclusion into Aaron's story - and that's exactly where it went.

Whilst it's great to see Danny Miller acting out all the angst and drama, I'm just angry that the writers have given him such a miserable storyline.

For me Aaron was a much more interesting character when he had happy times interspersed with his chaotic moments.

Yes - he has had "happy" moments with Jackson - but they're always "designed" to occur just before some new catastrophy befalls him.

For me - the writers have lost track of telling a real story about Aaron the character and become more interested in exploring Danny Millers acting ability.

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I am actually quite glad that Emmerdale didn't win the "broadcast of the year" at the Stonewall awards - it lost out to Coronation Street.
Whilst the coming out story was excellent - it feels like they've abandoned the character since then.
I'm glad the gay community hasn't rewarded them for doing that.

[sheepiefarm]

Hmm - give Aaron a tetraplegic boyfriend.

Makes it a heluvva lot easier to avoid showing homosexual intimacy between them on-screen

just saying

[Hawthorne]

Nov 9, 2010 9:01:45 GMT -5 sheepiefarm said:

Hmm - give Aaron a tetraplegic boyfriend.

Makes it a heluvva lot easier to avoid showing homosexual intimacy between them on-screen

just saying

Yes, I see it that way, too. Very convenient that now they can't be intimate. I predict that after Jackson, Aaron will fall in love with a guy who has no immune system and has to live inside a plastic bubble. Being intimate with Aaron would actually kill him.

[mycatfox]

^^^ Wow...this thread is just a few hours old...but it's already on fire! [/i][/b]

[sheepiefarm]

Nov 9, 2010 11:43:29 GMT -5 Hawthorne said:

Yes, I see it that way, too. Very convenient that now they can't be intimate. I predict that after Jackson, Aaron will fall in love with a guy who has no immune system and has to live inside a plastic bubble. Being intimate with Aaron would actually kill him.

You think he's gonna get another boyfriend

Ha ha - you have more faith than me ;D

[jjose712]

Well, i know Danny is incredibly good in the dramatic scenes, and i know the writing and the acting is good, but in my opinion, the storyline is an epic faliure.
Aaron's coming out was overdramatic, but i'm ok with that. My problem with Jackson storyline was that in my opinion they didn't seem a couple at all, best friends sometimes, other times not even that.
I don't know if it was that the actors feared the physical contact, but in my opinion the rare intimacy scenes didn't work.
And sorry, but making Jackson tetraplegic is a big mistake. Maybe it's realistic, unfortunately, this happens everyday. But that limits a lot the kind of storyline they could give the couple, and they will end being backburned no matter what.

In my opinion after such a dramatic coming out, Aaron deserved some light hearted storyline for some time.
And as i say, it's a pity, because both are good actors and i think they would overcome their problems in the intimacy scenes with a little time (in fact Danny Miller is showing a really great development in carry the gay issue in interviews, something that happened with other straight actors in gay roles before, he went from the "kissing a guy is so hard" to an "it gets better video")

[sooky]

Sheepie - I have never seen you as a Jackson-hater. In fact I've always considered your Posts to be somewhat on the thoughtful, insightful side. Just saying! I mean - it's no secret I've never wanted Jackson to be a permanent boyfriend to Aaron. I was getting gasped at for saying that in the very episode the two were happiest. But I really like his character as a character. Yet there are these... hm, times, when the writing shines through the story, which makes the storyline somewhat less... good. I just never really believed that Aaron genuinely loved Jackson. The other way round may very well be true; we just don't get enough information from his side. But Aaron? Somehow, I felt it to be more of a dependency than something else. Well, that is until they conveniently threw around their relationship. At the moment, I get a lot of vibe that suggests genuine concern and love... which I'm rather sceptical about, but oh well. Sometimes you forget you're watching a soap.
I've never really been concerned with the intimacy problem... Although there were moments, e.g. that peck on the kiss Jackson gave randombloke1 at Bar West, where I'd just go headdesk-wtf?! But Emmerdale generally never had too much physical intimacy, so I never really expected anything much. More importantly, maybe, there's been the issue that the two didn't give the vibe of being anything, really. Emmerdale focused too much on Aaron being a bad boy (and I'd say Danny too, either that or the directors insisted on ambiguous writing with nonchalant acting...) and the whole... I don't know. I used to think Emmerdale was good with everyday situations... and I still do think they're exceptionally good, but still they just fail miserably sometimes.

Oh, God, I actually posted...

[LadyArmand]

The main problem I have with the whole Jackson/Aaron storyline is that the chemistry between the two seems a bit off. I agree that at times they seemed more like good mates, this doesn’t have to be the actors fault, I’m of the opinion the writing didn’t give them much choice in the matter. They’re not all the believable to me as lovers. This is mainly because all the development between the two happened off screen in that two weeks or so they were away on vacation together. Whatever light heartedness was had off screen between the two in that time when no one was around to see it. To then have them come back and the relationship was to have progressed without the audience being privy to it was a huge mistake.

You then get these moments between them, that come off as inside jokes because the audience has to fill in the blanks. Don’t get me wrong there are times when filling in the blanks is a good thing, no one wants to be spoon fed everything. But to have to fill in ALL the blanks is ridiculous and tiring. It’s like the writes came up with an idea which was good at the time, but put little to no planning into it as to how to go from where they started. Now it seems to me they have effectively painted themselves in to a corner.

Aaron has always had it hard, nothing in his life has ever come easily to him. I didn’t expect love or the discovery that he is capable of loving someone to be any different. That being said however there is a vast difference between struggling to cope at times and being miserable 98.99% the time. Yes, Aaron needs to grow up. But that can be done without limiting him romantically as well as sexually. I say that because sometimes on soaps the writers don’t differentiate between sex and intimacy, instead they equate the two. But these particular writers decided to make Aaron’s sexuality an issue and are now running from it by paralyzing his “love” interest. I wouldn’t have a problem with this if they had effectively established the intimacy between Aaron and Jackson.

I’m in no way advocating shoving lovey-dovey, saccharine moments down our throats, but it would be nice to see why the relationship between Jackson and Aaron works. And I’m not talking about Aaron screwing up and Jackson getting mad then forgiving him for it. I’m talking about those moments where you see a bond that goes beyond the sex or friendship. Moments that speak to a level of comfort between them that explains who they can keep seeking each other out when there seems to be little they actually have in common.

[Zathras]

There's nothing much I can add at this point that I haven't already posted in one of the other threads, or that you guys haven't already said today. The situation is frustrating, as I'd come to expect more from the Emmerdale team. I keep having bad flashbacks to ATWT, and their decidedly plot-driven approach to storytelling. I'm hoping ED will get back to more character-driven development. I do think they're capable of putting the pieces together properly, but they've faltered recently.

[alicat]

Oooh, nice thread

Suddenly I feel liberated ;D. Gotta get ready for work now, but I'll be back!

[mycatfox]

The biggest issue that I have with this SL at the moment is that it's getting increasingly sadder, to the point that it really gets me down (I found myself skipping some of the clips... )

If I keep watching is because I totally love MS and DM, and the characters they portray. I atribute the SL's flaws to the sometimes inconsistent writing. About the likely heartbreaking outcome of the current story...well, Emmerdale is technically a soap opera, so there is still a (remote) possibility that there really is a miracle cure for Jackson (it would totally challenge my suspension of disbelief, but in this case, I wouldn't mind at all )

We'll see

[carld2]

I don't feel like I'm watching characters. I see actors. What they've done to Aaron is what happened with China Beach, a show that I loved but slowly grew sick of because it became all about the martyrdom of McMurphy (Dana Delaney), and how she suffered, and how noble she was, and how screwed up she was.

Aaron is empty, and I don't really enjoy seeing animals killed and other characters horribly injured just to make us weep over how noble his emptiness is.

It's almost like some sort of bizarro version of the old hurt/comfort fics, only this time Aaron is the one who is really supposed to be hurting (not the plot device in the hospital bed) and we should comfort him.

I think Blyth has made Emmerdale, once the most character-driven soap around, very plot-driven, and when you are plot-driven that means it's difficult for (some) viewers to invest. I should care about some poor drug-addicted girl prostituting herself and I should care about someone being quadraplegic, but when the whole thing is so by the numbers, I just don't.

And I don't know where they will ever take Aaron after this. I still think there was a lot of potential wasted with Victoria. It's too bad they didn't want to tell a bisexual storyline -- since they are unable or unwilling to show a real relationship between two men, having a gay character seems pointless.

[sheepiefarm]

This is a comment I posted earlier today in the midst of a discussion about whether Danny Miller was uncomfortable to play gay or not.
I have posted it here because for some it may seem as a negative / condemnation kind of post.


For me – the whole storyline with Jackson has never really made much sense from the way I perceived Aaron to be as a character during his coming out.
We are told time & time again that Aaron is a young guy who has trouble with his sexuality (Danny reiterates this in almost every interview) – and yet the storyline that Aaron has been given since coming out really hasn’t backed up this characterisation.

Within a few weeks of being dragged kicking & screaming out of the closet – he’s straight into a relationship with a guy he barely knows (and lets not forget, this is the same guy who he physically assaulted).
Had this relationship been clandestine & secret, held away from the prying eyes of his neighbours – then fair enough. But no – he was wandering up & down the village main street, drinking in his local and generally behaving in the manner of someone who had been open & out for many months / years.
Not the actions of someone with “issues”.

Did he have much negative reaction to his sexuality to deal with (and therefore compound his issues), well apart from a relatively mild comment from his grandfather and an instance with a pantomime thug from community service – No, he didn’t – so not much to reinforce his characterisation there.

Has he been shown to be someone who has problems with being sexually intimate with a guy “Like I’m some sort of pervert - like I do THAT with other men” (to quote Aaron himself). Well, for the most part, whenever the sexual side of his relationship with Jackson gets referenced, it’s always in the tone that things are positive, healthy and satisfactory. There seems to be no sense of shame, embarrassment or guilt on Aaron’s part.
So – no issues there either.

Does he have issues being around other gay men or socialising in a gay environment. Well, apart from at the beginning, it would now seem that he is comfortable with this too – on familiar terms with the bar staff and willing to venture there on his own and even with his straight friends (Adam, Paddy & Marlon).
So – not much sign of ongoing issues there then.


Personally – I can’t help but feel that Aaron has become a bit lost in his characterisation. Danny continues to portray him in a similar manner to his coming out days – and I actually agree with this. Given the depth of his self-hate & self-loathing and the fact that was still less than a year ago – then Aaron should still be wrapped up somewhere within that identity.

Unfortunately – the storyliners haven’t backed up this characterisation with the storyline they came up with.
And that happened because they wrote a storyline for Danny Miller, rather than for the character of Aaron Livesy.
They became so enamoured with Danny’s ability to portray angst & distress and the recognition he received for it, that they hastily concocted this whole relationship / crash / paralysed boyfriend storyline, however, for this to work within the time-frame they had it planned for, they needed to have Aaron embedded far enough into a relationship for his distress to carry some relevance. Hence, we had this fantastic leap in Aaron’s character.

At the moment (for me) – the character of Aaron has become a bit lost in the wilderness. He is no longer who he was, and yet he has been unable to progress to being someone else.
It has been a storyline that has completely conflicted with characterisation and in the process – they have robbed Aaron of his identity.

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For the time being I think Danny has done a reasonable job of portraying Aaron within the context of the story that he has been given to play.
For the time being – I will reserve judgement on whether or not Danny is comfortable playing gay until I’ve seen how the story with Flynn goes.

[patroclus]

hello sheepie. Thanks for such an interesting post.

Overall, I think Emmerdale has intended this relationship to be a sort of transitional proving ground for Aaron through which he gradually experiences connectedness and mutuality and becomes humanised, moving away from the 'wild' creature he was. At the same time it was intended to show him gradually becoming accustomed to his sexuali identity and his sexuality. And a third element is him simply growing up, developing a more adult response to himself and the world around him.

If the above is accurate as to the show's intentions then you can say that broadly they've done that. But they've tended to use a very oblique method of storytelling to do it. Most soap stories are conveyed by explicit content - there are scenes and dialogues and plots which enable actors to put their characters feelings, thoughts, conflicts overtly up onto the screen. But Emmerdale has show this whole development of Aaron's character largely through HOW they've depicted it, not through WHAT they've depicted - telling it largely through form, not content. That's a very sophisticated and very risky tactic.

So - we went for - how long? 90 days (you did the counting, sheepie!) - without Aaron or Jackson having any physical contact on screen, despite the fact they were in the first days and weeks of a new relationship. I think that the audience was being invited to conclude from that that Aaron was uncomfortable and finding physical - maybe sexual? - intimacy with another man difficult. But there was no content to make that explicit so viewers, me included, got confused and frustrated. Was it a deliberate aesthetic choice or incompetence or the reluctance of Danny and/or Marc to show intimacy?

This went on until the holiday. After that there was, for me, a definite shift in how they behaved - more playfulness, some physical intimacy - Jackson smacking Aaron's behind stands out. Aaron's self-revealing speech before the crash was the summation and articulation of all the preceeding 5 months - the first time it was made explicit. And he describes in that speech how he has moved from wanting to die to starting to feel something for other people, to starting to feel ok with who he is. And he says 'I know I'm not exactly doing cartwheels' - which acknowledges the reticence and restraint which he's been feeling and which has been expressed in the manner in which the relationship has been depicted.

So, I think Emmerdale made a decision to embody how Aaron was feeling in how they depicted the relationship - repressed and reticent - rather than explicitly writing scenes where it was put out in dialogue and plot.

Since the crash they've had Aaron showing more tenderness, initiating kisses etc. All at baby/toddler level in terms of maturity - or maybe primary school would be more accurate. So he buys Jackson a t shirt for Christmas. It's meant to depict a breakthrough in his ability to care for someone else.

That's how I think the show means to be read. Whether this has been successful is another matter. There's immense frustration with former fans of the show. Some can't recover from the expectation that Aaron/Jackson should be a movie love story; some can't believe that Jackson won't recover. some think the whole thing is a mess; some that it embodies media homophobia.

My guess is that the Flynn Buchanan (boo, hiss! I want Jackson!) story will shift Aaron to the third year of secondary school, emotionally speaking! I guess that he'll be more open to feelings, more impulsive and take some risks. But it's not going to be 'the one' either.

For myself, I think Emmerdale have done well to put a relationship up there which has a lot going for it but which simply doesn't work out. I think they should have put more explicit content and told a clearer story - given more content and relied less on form to tell this one.

On the other hand I may be fantasising all of the above. It may simply be that they've been muddled, timid and uncertain all along!

If

[patroclus]

'At the moment (for me) – the character of Aaron has become a bit lost in the wilderness. He is no longer who he was, and yet he has been unable to progress to being someone else.'

sheepie: I can see exactly what you mean here. Aaron used to be really good at being closed, conflicted, wounded and screwed up.

But he's pretty rubbish at being warm, kind, loving and life-affirming! So it's painful to watch him hand over such a lame present to Jackson, with the 'I'm just a beginner at this' label in his every gesture! Buying for Jackson should be a doddle for anyone with an ounce of sense. What's his signature item of clothing? The striking casual shirt, of course! (I should be his boyfriend!!! Damn, damn!) LOL

[sheepiefarm]

Jan 3, 2011 7:11:13 GMT -5 patroclus said:

'At the moment (for me) – the character of Aaron has become a bit lost in the wilderness. He is no longer who he was, and yet he has been unable to progress to being someone else.'

sheepie: I can see exactly what you mean here. Aaron used to be really good at being closed, conflicted, wounded and screwed up.

But he's pretty rubbish at being warm, kind, loving and life-affirming! So it's painful to watch him hand over such a lame present to Jackson, with the 'I'm just a beginner at this' label in his every gesture! Buying for Jackson should be a doddle for anyone with an ounce of sense. What's his signature item of clothing? The striking casual shirt, of course! (I should be his boyfriend!!! Damn, damn!) LOL

But the thing is – I don’t think he is being warm, kind, loving and life affirming.
I think he’s just going through the motions.

On many levels, it feels like Aaron has become more repressed than he ever was before. He has an air about him now that depicts a young lad who feels he should be apologising for his existence. He seems to have lost his confidence, his opinion and his drive.

Before Aaron came out, he was disengaged from the rest of the world, from those around him.
When I watch him now – I see a young lad who's actually starting to become disengaged from himself.

[patroclus]

'On many levels, it feels like Aaron has become more repressed than he ever was before. He has an air about him now that depicts a young lad who feels he should be apologising for his existence. He seems to have lost his confidence, his opinion and his drive.

Before Aaron came out, he was disengaged from the rest of the world, from those around him.
When I watch him now – I see a young lad who's actually starting to become disengaged from himself.'

Mmmm, sheepie: that's interesting. I can't help wondering if this is your specific interpretation of him - or do you think that this is how Emmerdale intends the audience to understand what has happened for Aaron? I feel we may both be seeing the same behaviours and seeing them as muted and awkward, but interpreting them differently. I feel he's not so much going through the motions, in a spiritless, defeated kind of way, but trying out completely new behaviours that he's not used to and doesn't pull off very elegantly. Do you not think Aaron was talking authentically when he said to Jackson on the night of the accident that he was beginning to feel things for people but didn't know what the feelings were? That he no longer wanted to die and felt ok about being himself? Because your interpretation would require us to disbelieve that account and see it as how he'd like to be seen rather than how he genuinely feels about himself and his life.

[sheepiefarm]

patroclus

I’m referring to his behaviour since the crash.
What he said on the night of the crash was undoubtedly true – but his behaviour since the crash is where the real change has happened.

Up to that point he was experiencing life in a way he never experienced before – he was beginning to accept, get used to and actually like who he is / was.

Then – after being honest & truthful (which is what Jackson wanted), Jackson walked away from him.
Then the crash happened and Jackson’s life was torn apart.

Consider something he said on the night of the crash

“Anybody that ever gets close to me always ends up getting hurt”

Notice how he phrases it as someone getting close to him, rather than him getting close to someone!

Even when he stepped out from the shadow that was his life – even when he allowed someone to see the “real” him – even when he realised that he could live a life as the person whom he had hated being………………….

………………………..terrible things happen.

Much of the storyline since the crash has been about Aaron blaming himself – even the events leading up to him going back to Jackson were more about doing the “right” thing than they were about how HE felt.

For most of this relationship – he’s been left having to “prove” himself to Jackson – he has continually had to try and become a better person to “justify” Jackson’s love – because every time he failed – Jackson walked away.
And even in going back to Jackson – his justification was more about not “running” away than it was about loving Jackson.

Aaron needs to learn to see himself as an individual, and that his self-worth is not bound up by his need to prove himself to Jackson.

The whole storyline with Jackson has been an interesting one, and Aaron has learnt a lot from Jackson - but in many ways, much of his learning has been about trying to be a better person by trying to epitomise what Jackson stands for.
Aaron needs to grasp the fact that he is not Jackson

At the moment - it feels to me like Aaron has actually lost his identity - he has spent most of his relationship with Jackson trying to be someone else - trying to become someone worthy enough for Jackson's love.
Whilst that may have been necessary to break the self-hating cycle that Aaron had existed in - he cannot exist in that vacuum forever.

I have no idea how Emmerdale expect us to interpret things – and I think that is currently one of the failings of it as a storyline.

[carld2]

Jan 2, 2011 22:23:09 GMT -5 sheepiefarm said:

It has been a storyline that has completely conflicted with characterisation and in the process – they have robbed Aaron of his identity.

This seems to be a running theme with Emmerdale now. Nearly every story has chosen misery or depressing material in place of all else. Characterization is few and far between. The idea of lighthearted material is a horror show like Declan's father.

[patroclus]

Aaron returns at last... and for the first time I find myself seriously unimpressed with Danny Miller's acting. He seems to have fallen back on recycling a series of facial mannerisms in lieu of any coherent responses to other characters in his scenes. It practically amounts to scowly gurning! So Aaron is re-united with the man he recently made a serious commitment to. No smiles, no kisses or happiness of any sort. No, Jackson ruefully tells him how useless he felt during the fire. Aaron scowls in silence and rolls his eyes, looking fed up. Isn't that just weird? Later we see them chatting - and Aaron's multi-tasking absently, reading the paper at the same time. In the pub he's looking away from Jackson, looking blank and bored - until Charity arrives and again, the exaggerated frowning and surly responses. What is it all supposed to convey because to me it feels generic and meaningless and going through the motions.

[nomdeplume8ie]

Hmmm...yeah. I see what you mean.

But then, a part of me has an extremely convoluted explanation for Danny's histrionic grumbles and eye rolls in yesterday's episode. Bear with me on this one .

Ok... here goes (deep breath)
1. Jackson has been feeling down in the dumps because he feels useless to other people.
2. He mentions this to Aaron when he comes back.
3. Aaron, in some scene we don't see, must have texted Charity about cheering Jackson up.
4. As Joe is leaving, Aaron is 'reading' the paper...knowing that Charity's visiting any second.
5. As Charity is telling Jackson about her fake problem, Danny starts giving the histrionic looks... but... I think that it's meant to be thought of as Aaron (not Danny) giving the histrionics, since Aaron is trying to pretend that he has nothing to do with Charity's seeking of Jackson's advice. And Aaron is a mechanic, and not an actor by profession. So I'm thinking that Danny was directed to be histrionic, like he also was in the pub later on. So essentially, Danny was acting as a bad actor in those scenes.... I think.

I suppose, the thing is, Aaron isn't really the schemey type and thinks more with his emotions and fists; so the fact that Aaron boxed clever: knowing that Jackson would have refused to give Aaron advice because he'd know it'd be seen as charity and thus injure Jackson's pride and instead uses Charity (ironic) to dish out the pride charity to Jackson, was probably a bit out of character.

It was more like something Cain'd do; unless we're supposed to fill the blanks about some advice Cain might have given to Aaron while they were away (just like we had to fill in the blanks about that supposedly amazing holiday that Aarson went on and we didn't see sigh).

[patroclus]

nomdeplume8ie: I think you're absolutely right. That does make sense of it. Afterwards I could work it out. But at the time it was just senseless. And that can't be right, can it? Even with Charity, who must be in on the kindly deception, he was frowning away and acting as if he didn't know about it. Only the smile at the end communicated his intentions. It might have seemed clever on the page to double bluff both Jackson within the fiction and the audience outside it but it should communicate while it's happening not look weird and clumsy and rely on you putting it together 10 minutes after the episode has ended. Not subtle or well-conveyed to me. I'm just generally pissed off by it. Don't want Flynn, don't want to watch the end of Jackson/Aaron dragged out...

[sheepiefarm]

@nom & Patroclus

Double bluff my arse.

Those scenes have got less to do with Aarson and more to do with the Cain / Charity / Jai storyline.

You've read waay too much into them.

Say what you see on the screen.

Aaron looking confused about it all - then as Charity walks away - the penny drops for Aaron.

At best - Aaron may have mentioned in conversation to Cain & Charity that Jackson is fed-up.
As you'll see from tonights ep - they are just being used as pawns in the other storyline.

[beautifullion69]

Jan 19, 2011 16:25:09 GMT -5 sheepiefarm said:

@nom & Patroclus

Double bluff my arse.

Those scenes have got less to do with Aarson and more to do with the Cain / Charity / Jai storyline.

You've read waay too much into them.

Say what you see on the screen.

Aaron looking confused about it all - then as Charity walks away - the penny drops for Aaron.

At best - Aaron may have mentioned in conversation to Cain & Charity that Jackson is fed-up.
As you'll see from tonights ep - they are just being used as pawns in the other storyline.

but why would charity say 'i won't tell anyone and ruin your bad boy image' as if aaron actually did something nice/thoughtful? that whole moment was confusing mostly due to aaron's reactions.