Gabi
Junior Member
Posts: 206
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Post by Gabi on Apr 24, 2008 8:07:07 GMT -5
The biggest lie of all was when Deniz did not tell Roman the truth about Bulle. We won't forget that. And that lie is hard to excuse.
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Post by lolaruns on Apr 24, 2008 10:38:10 GMT -5
I guess what annoys me so much is that by extension Deniz was lying all the way through his and Roman's relationship, everytime when he pretended to be comfortable. My personal theory is that for his macho personality it was easier to find an excuse to be with Roman as long as he could tell himself that he way playing hero (helping Roman against the evil ice hockey team, making up for what the evil ice hockey team had done to Roman, stand by Roman through the evil prejudices of Marian). But then suddenly all the obstacles were gone, the team had shut up, Marian was coming around and suddenly there was no heroic outside reason anymore. And so Deniz made up a reason (falling for Vanessa) to sabotage the relationship. The problem wasn't the team teasing him or Marian's potential homophobia, it was Deniz himself all along. (Christian's "I will project all my fears on Gregor and pretend that he is the problem" wasn't all that different) But yes, that's men for you. Unable to say "Hey, Roman, I think I'm not ready/comfortable yet" or to say "Hey, Vanessa, I think I might have to think a bit more about my sexuality, can we take a break" and would rather lie and cheat. Sigh. I though the whole point of soap operas was to have awesome and romantic and likable (not to mention HOT) men rather than *realistic* ones. I mean, it's not like men would want to watch tv shows only about only "realistic" looking women or men with realistic boring jobs any more than women enjoy shows with only men with realistic personalities. It's entertainment. We all want to be lied to a bit, as much as we also want things we can identify with. It's an interesting feature of these stories, which makes me wonder if that is a soap staple or a change in the public mind, that in our stories we have these guys like Deniz and Christian who start fooling around with a guy and then do have the relationship and do state publicly that they are gay when one wonders if at that point they are really ready for it. If it wouldn't benefit them more if they played around a while longer before they KNOW that this is what they want. Instead it's almost like if you are screwing a guy it's the honorable thing to do to stand up for the relationship and out yourself. And in a way it is. It just amuses me because at times it almost feels like the modern version of "You got her pregnant, now marry her, even if you aren't mature enough yet/You had sex with him, now be gay, that's the upstanding thing to do".
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Post by Bonobochick on Apr 24, 2008 10:47:56 GMT -5
Interesting analysis of Deniz. He's a complete mess. Totally confused but then 90% of what he does in reaction to crises makes things so much worse. I think when Deniz was with Roman alone, he was comfortable being who he was though he still couldn't really talk about his actual feelings but add anyone to the mix and he'd bristle. He may be coming around to realizing he is gay (and actually I think he already has but is still fighting it) but he's so far from being ok with other's knowing despite all the making out in public that they did (hey Steinkamp pool & locker room!). Deniz seemed to be constantly defending his relationship with Roman. While Deniz had transferred yet more of his confusion on to Roman after the kiss, this time Roman's actually been paying attention so he knows that it's Deniz's stubborn reaction to not wanting to deal with his sexuality that's the problem. On some weird level I think knowing this is why I get the feeling TIIC are going to have Roman wait for Deniz instead of moving on for the time being.
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Post by psionycx on Apr 24, 2008 10:54:16 GMT -5
Relatively few people Deniz's age are ready for serious relationship anyway. I do think that to some extent Vanessa is a "safe" option that he is clinging to, even as he tries to keep Roman in his orbit.
Roman needs to pull an Olli and be seen with other men. Christian's possessiveness is what brought things to a head there and it would probably be the same with Deniz. Right now he feels he can have his cake and eat it too. Roman is still openly hung up over him and so Deniz is free to get close and then push away as his mood swings back and forth. By allowing it Roman is letting the whole mess grow.
The main problem is that Deniz doesn't seem like relationship material for anyone at this point. He's still very immature, erratic, self-centered and demonstrates a near total lack of empathy. In other words he's a fairly typical male his age. If I were Roman I would have already moved on because this one's just not ready for a relationship yet.
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Post by lolaruns on Apr 24, 2008 10:55:04 GMT -5
See, I disagree. When Deniz was with Roman, everybody knew about it. It wasn't a question of hiding the relationship from others like it is with Christian deciding whether he wants Gregor to know or not.
They were already a public couple and accepted as a couple. Even as he is with Vanessa now, everybody still knows that he used to be with Roman. Most of all it doesn't explain why he was sleeping around with Vanessa in secret if his problem was being seen in public with Roman. And why during that time he was secretly dreaming of carrying things on with both of them. (not to mention if Roman hadn't told him about the injury lie Deniz might have guilt stayed with him longer)
So I think it has to be internalized. Maybe Deniz needed Vanessa, because he needed to feel more manly for himself and his ego or whatever his problem is. Because at that point the outside world already didn't really care anymore.
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Post by Bonobochick on Apr 24, 2008 11:09:36 GMT -5
See, I disagree. When Deniz was with Roman, everybody knew about it. It wasn't a question of hiding the relationship from others like it is with Christian deciding whether he wants Gregor to know or not. They were already a public couple and accepted as a couple. Even as he is with Vanessa now, everybody still knows that he used to be with Roman. Most of all it doesn't explain why he was sleeping around with Vanessa in secret if his problem was being seen in public with Roman. And why during that time he was secretly dreaming of carrying things on with both of them. (not to mention if Roman hadn't told him about the injury lie Deniz might have guilt stayed with him longer) So I think it has to be internalized. Maybe Deniz needed Vanessa, because he needed to feel more manly for himself or whatever his problem is. Because at that point the outside world already didn't really care anymore. Everyone knew about his relationship with Roman, of course, as they weren't exactly secretive with all the PDA but Deniz was still very defensive. He didn't hide his relationship with Roman but I think he was paranoid about it. Deniz's issues are so internal. Problem is while I think most of us watching the show get that, I don't think TIIC are doing the best job in portraying it thus instead of empathizing with the internalized conflict issues that are causing Deniz to act like a selfish, lying ass you just want to smack him. Oh, and psionycx, I've been wanting another man to come on the scene for a while now, not just to make Roman happy/take his mind off stalking Deniz and let the man get some, but also cause I wanted to see Deniz's reaction to it. I don't understand why TIIC aren't trying that route out.
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Post by psionycx on Apr 24, 2008 12:02:00 GMT -5
Oh, and psionycx, I've been wanting another man to come on the scene for a while now, not just to make Roman happy/take his mind off stalking Deniz and let the man get some, but also cause I wanted to see Deniz's reaction to it. I don't understand why TIIC aren't trying that route out. It would make sense, and also I honestly think that right now Roman's just too much of a victim in this whole drama. He's really been depicted as rather pathetic, as opposed to Deniz whose been depicted as rather a jerk. Vanessa's a safe bet for Deniz, and I'll confess as harsh as it seems I think it's because he's such a hottie that she would have a hard time finding a comparable replacement. And I think that Deniz exploits that, just as he exploits Roman's feelings for him, to keep them both within reach so that they remain available should he want them. Now, if Roman were to start seeing another guy, especially a very cute one, I strongly suspect that Deniz would see red. In particular if it looked like Roman was giving up on him to go be with someone else. It would be good if AWZ played that line and brought Deniz down a peg, regardless of whether he and Roman got back together. Right now he's pretty easy to dislike considering what a player he is.
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Post by Bonobochick on Apr 24, 2008 12:14:09 GMT -5
Oh, and psionycx, I've been wanting another man to come on the scene for a while now, not just to make Roman happy/take his mind off stalking Deniz and let the man get some, but also cause I wanted to see Deniz's reaction to it. I don't understand why TIIC aren't trying that route out. It would make sense, and also I honestly think that right now Roman's just too much of a victim in this whole drama. He's really been depicted as rather pathetic, as opposed to Deniz whose been depicted as rather a jerk. Vanessa's a safe bet for Deniz, and I'll confess as harsh as it seems I think it's because he's such a hottie that she would have a hard time finding a comparable replacement. And I think that Deniz exploits that, just as he exploits Roman's feelings for him, to keep them both within reach so that they remain available should he want them. Now, if Roman were to start seeing another guy, especially a very cute one, I strongly suspect that Deniz would see red. In particular if it looked like Roman was giving up on him to go be with someone else. It would be good if AWZ played that line and brought Deniz down a peg, regardless of whether he and Roman got back together. Right now he's pretty easy to dislike considering what a player he is. Let's put this in an email to send to TIIC cause I love it. This is the route TIIC need to take and not having Deniz flip between "being in love with Vanessa" to wanting but resisting & blaming Roman. That's been going on waaaaaay too long. Time to change it up and I think bringing a new man in for Roman is the right thing. Sadly, I know that there is nothing like that at through early June. *sigh* But here's hoping that we start to see spoilers along that nature for late June.
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maya
Full Member
Posts: 2,137
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Post by maya on Apr 24, 2008 14:15:14 GMT -5
I've finally watched episodes 410 and 411 and sorry if I did say so but they left me rather cold. I've waited eagerly for the so much advertised kiss hoping that it will be the start of a new turning point for AWZ but I felt completely left down. In 410 episode Deniz started to kiss Roman who was petrified from the unexpected kiss and so he didn't response, in yesterday episode though Roman started to reciprocate the kiss and Deniz immediately moved away. I was hoping to see a little bit of the old magic (they were so good in the making out scenes ) but for me there wasn't any. About Deniz "come in come out from the closet" behaviour, my BIG problem is: I've already watched it! I followed him during his internal turmoils, problems and confused feelings, I don't need to see it a second time, it's just like "who shoot J.R." in Dallas, the first time was a huge hit, if after few months I'm forced to watch it again, it's boring. That's make me think that the writers are running in circles going absolutely nowhere with the plot.
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Post by psionycx on Apr 24, 2008 15:11:32 GMT -5
maya, this is why they need to bring in a new man for Roman!
They're circling because they're focusing too much on Deniz's flakiness. Okay, that's been established, now it's time to motivate him into some action.
If they're planning to get Deniz back together with Roman then they should start moving in that direction. If they're not then they need to give Roman a new storyline.
The best motivator would of course be for Roman to find a new man. This would either pull him out of Deniz's orbit or else force Deniz to stop acting ambivalent about him.
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Post by babylondancer on Apr 25, 2008 4:00:40 GMT -5
But the problem is that Roman is deeply in love with Deniz and not interested in other men at all. If I remember correctly he even said so a few times. His wet dream could turn up and hit on him, he wouldn't do anything. He's not 18 anymore and can wait for the man he wants, especially now that he's sure that Deniz wants him too. I agree that it would be best if he moved on because that would make Deniz go after him. Which man doesn't like challenge and starts to hunt as soon as the bag runs away? But I don't think it's in Roman's character.
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Post by Bonobochick on Apr 25, 2008 10:44:58 GMT -5
But the problem is that Roman is deeply in love with Deniz and not interested in other men at all. If I remember correctly he even said so a few times. His wet dream could turn up and hit on him, he wouldn't do anything. He's not 18 anymore and can wait for the man he wants, especially now that he's sure that Deniz wants him too. I agree that it would be best if he moved on because that would make Deniz go after him. Which man doesn't like challenge and starts to hunt as soon as the bag runs away? But I don't think it's in Roman's character. Could be the case. I mean, I am sure most - if not all - of us have had our heart broken by someone we still were in love with or still had deep feelings for and tried to move on but found it impossibly hard at first. I think seeing Deniz all the time doesn't help Roman, but since it's a soap, they can't have him change up his life too much in order to avoid Deniz or try to move on completely. Still, at some point Roman's got to at least try going out and having fun. He can't mope forever and Roman is too prime a piece to languish waiting for Deniz to wake the hell up. It's not fair to the character of Roman to have him backburner while TIIC do Deniz's coming out take two not to mention it's rather dull to watch Roman act like he's on pause. He's too lively a character for that. Where's his rebound man?
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Post by lolaruns on Apr 25, 2008 12:21:31 GMT -5
The problem is based on what? It surely can't be Deniz' sparking personality. I get lust on first sight as much any anybody, but hasn't it all happend to us that we fell for somebody badly and then when we actually got to know them realized they were a crazy person? In my experience that scares off even guys.
There is also the factor that Roman doesn't necessarily come across like somebody experienced, calm, lived his life and now opens himself to love. There were some earlier DG interviews where he described Roman as very desparate for a relationship, that that is why he sort of looks at everybody he meets yearningly to see if somebody will look back.
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Post by Bonobochick on Apr 25, 2008 12:50:55 GMT -5
The problem is based on what? It surely can't be Deniz' sparking personality. I get lust on first sight as much any anybody, but hasn't it all happend to us that we fell for somebody badly and then when we actually got to know them realized they were a crazy person? In my experience that scares off even guys. Might be one of those cases where he is so sure that he is right and that Deniz has genuine feelings for him, that the issue him but Deniz's own conflicts, that he might wait it out. I've seen it happen before and I even did something like that when I was like 16 with a guy, so I can kind of get that mindset even though it's not playing out well.
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Post by psionycx on Apr 25, 2008 20:22:50 GMT -5
He needs to work the Olli Principle. Olli was madly in love with Christian, who was very conflicted as well. But things got brought to a head quickly enough when Christian saw Olli with another guy, especially one that he considered undeserving.
Deniz is doing what he's doing because he can get away with it without repercussions. He is not oblivious to the hold he has over Roman much as he denies everything. It works for him because Vanessa and Roman both think he's the perfect mate. Unfortunately, the way he plays that demonstrates that he really isn't.
It would therefore good to knock him off his pedestal because his ego is roughly as large as the Hindenburg and even more potentially incendiary.
Roman may be a hopeless romantic and compulsive victim, but honestly he needs to at least play the field. If nothing else it would be a more effective strategy for breaking through Deniz's aura of self-absorption than standing around making cow eyes at him.
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Post by babylondancer on Apr 28, 2008 5:30:07 GMT -5
Over the weekend I've watched quite a few old episodes of AWZ completely, and now I bye it even less that Deniz should suddenly be straight because he never was straight from the first moment he came to Essen. He always knew that he was into guys and told so pretty early when he arrived. As far as I understood he even was a virgin and wasn't in the least interested in girls at all. It's not that because of Roman he suddenly knew what was the matter with him. He already told people BEFORE they got together. The only thing is he thought it was a phase that will end eventually. He also told people that Marian would never accept a gay son and that he fears that Marian is already looking for a wife for him in Turkey. And Marian himself told Nadja that Deniz can't be gay because it's not running in the family. 'No Oztürk son can be gay.'
When you see the scenes between Bulle and that other moron and Deniz you can see that he wasn't only afraid of them thinking he's gay, but also of them beating the hell out of him. They blackmailed him, saying that they would show the clip on their mobile to the police where only Deniz's face could be seen clearly so that he would surely have been the only one accused of the bashing. He tried to find help in his father BEFORE the bashing, but instead of giving him a good advise Marian only told him stories from his own past. And seeing that they had their own share in semi-criminal activities I guess it was out of Deniz' mind to go to the police. He then tried to warn Roman, but he didn't take him seriously. An adult with life experiences might have called the police, but Deniz who's still a kid who's not used to taking own decisions just didn't know what to do.
I can more or less understand everything that Deniz went through and why he didn't do anything against the bashing. What I don't get at all is why he suddenly can be with Vanessa and think he's straight. I still understand that he wants to be everything his father wants him to be and that he might be thinking that life is easier for a straight man. But how can he suddenly get it up with a girl???
And all this leads me to believing that the story between Roman and Deniz can't be over. I'm sure we'll see them together again. I wouldn't even be surprised at all if we learned that Vanessa and Deniz only had sex once and then never again. (Do we even know for sure that they did it apart from Vanessa telling her father? Because we know that Vanessa would tell her father a lot of things just to piss him off.)
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Post by Bonobochick on Apr 28, 2008 11:16:48 GMT -5
Over the weekend I've watched quite a few old episodes of AWZ completely, and now I bye it even less that Deniz should suddenly be straight because he never was straight from the first moment he came to Essen. He always knew that he was into guys and told so pretty early when he arrived. As far as I understood he even was a virgin and wasn't in the least interested in girls at all. It's not that because of Roman he suddenly knew what was the matter with him. He already told people BEFORE they got together. The only thing is he thought it was a phase that will end eventually. He also told people that Marian would never accept a gay son and that he fears that Marian is already looking for a wife for him in Turkey. And Marian himself told Nadja that Deniz can't be gay because it's not running in the family. 'No Oztürk son can be gay.' When you see the scenes between Bulle and that other moron and Deniz you can see that he wasn't only afraid of them thinking he's gay, but also of them beating the hell out of him. They blackmailed him, saying that they would show the clip on their mobile to the police where only Deniz's face could be seen clearly so that he would surely have been the only one accused of the bashing. He tried to find help in his father BEFORE the bashing, but instead of giving him a good advise Marian only told him stories from his own past. And seeing that they had their own share in semi-criminal activities I guess it was out of Deniz' mind to go to the police. He then tried to warn Roman, but he didn't take him seriously. An adult with life experiences might have called the police, but Deniz who's still a kid who's not used to taking own decisions just didn't know what to do. I can more or less understand everything that Deniz went through and why he didn't do anything against the bashing. What I don't get at all is why he suddenly can be with Vanessa and think he's straight. I still understand that he wants to be everything his father wants him to be and that he might be thinking that life is easier for a straight man. But how can he suddenly get it up with a girl??? And all this leads me to believing that the story between Roman and Deniz can't be over. I'm sure we'll see them together again. I wouldn't even be surprised at all if we learned that Vanessa and Deniz only had sex once and then never again. (Do we even know for sure that they did it apart from Vanessa telling her father? Because we know that Vanessa would tell her father a lot of things just to piss him off.) Great post, BD. I like a lot of your analysis, though I have to disagree with the DeVa sex. I think they do it fairly regularly *shudders* but I've yet to see it not be due to Vanessa's instigation. The few times they've been shown to be heading to something intimate, Vanessa is always the lusty one trying to get it going and Deniz's reaction seems to waiver from acquiescence to distraction. He's never shown real enthusiam, let's put it that way. I think his age and the fact that he cares for Vanessa allows him get it up for her (think Noah & Maddie from ATWT) but never with the passion we've see between he & Roman during their sexual interludes. I agree that the early clips show that it is virtually impossible for Deniz to be straight. Now, I wouldn't put it past TIIC to complete retcon Deniz's sexuality though I really do not think they plan to that because they still keep the little things in that makes you realize he knows his relationship with Vanessa is a charade for the most part. Anyhoo, from the moment Deniz showed up, you could tell before he even confirmed it that he wasn't really in to girls. I missed the virgin part, though. I did see the clip where he mentioned what happened to him in Munich with the other guy and that he thought it was a phase. Looking at Deniz now, I think he knows he's gay but he isn't going to let that stop him from being with Vanessa. What was the clip where Deniz & Marian speak Turkish? Can someone link that as I'd like to see it. Vielen dank!
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Post by lolaruns on Apr 28, 2008 11:39:55 GMT -5
I don't follow AWZ that regularly but it seemed to me that there was this one time where Vanessa woke him by tickling him with her hair. He started instigating and then she ran out of him because Juli needed advice and he sort of pouted.
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Post by Bonobochick on Apr 29, 2008 1:42:00 GMT -5
I just watched 280 on Gabi's clips, the one with Roman being gay bashed ( awz-favourites.blogspot.com/2008/04/nie-wieder-eislaufen.html) & 281 with the fallout from the bashing ( awz-favourites.blogspot.com/2008/04/verzweiflung.html), and those were tough to watch. Well done but very unsettling. It explains so much about Deniz and Roman in how they came together too early for one another. Good call, babylondancer. Very heartbreaking stuff. Dennis and Igor were great with the material. The second time around for DeRo better be more even emotionally and maturity-wise but that could take some time.
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Gabi
Junior Member
Posts: 206
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Post by Gabi on May 2, 2008 5:34:36 GMT -5
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Post by Bonobochick on May 4, 2008 20:20:37 GMT -5
I am excited about this week!! 3 days. I hope it doesn't disappoint, especially Wednesday.
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Post by lolaruns on May 4, 2008 23:53:39 GMT -5
Yes, the spoilers sound promising. Go kiss fallout!
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Post by Bonobochick on May 5, 2008 10:23:51 GMT -5
For those who get to see it in Germany in a few hours, help a sista out with a recap? Vielen dank!
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Post by lolaruns on May 5, 2008 12:39:38 GMT -5
Okay, based on memory:
1.) Deniz flashed back to the kiss with Roman twice. Once when he saw Roman at the bar and once when Vanessa apologized that she was unfairly jelaous (of the models).
2.) Roman and some chick are drinking and commenting on the hotness or lack of of the guys in the bar. Deniz seems irritated. Has kiss flashback. Vanessa arrives (there is a funny scene where she pretends to be a an asking Deniz or an autograph). She says that she hasn't seen much of him in the last few days even though Jenny said their schedule wasn't that demanding and asks him what is up. Roman raises his eyebrows to Deniz, to me it looked like he was encouraging/daring Deniz to say it was because he kissed Roman.
3.) Deniz whimps out and says it's because of Marian and Nina. They both bitch about Nina. Vanessa assures him that everything will be fine.
4.) Deniz brings Roman the check and Roman hassles him a bit, giving him a huge tip which Deniz refuses, grabbing his hand which prompts Deniz to tell him to fuck off and he jokingly asks if he (Roman) doesn't get a good night kiss today.
5.) Deniz and Vanessa in bed together, naked. She jokes that she wants him just for his body. He pretends to be offended and says it's unfair that girls get to say that and men always get beat i they look after hot girls. She says looking it okay, touching isn't. Says she overreacted a bit about the thing with the models. Says she wonders whether he would rather be with one of those models. He says of course not. Vanessa says "Jealousy sucks, especially if there is no reason for it". Deniz flashes back to the kiss with Roman.
6.) Next morning. Vanessa is still asleep. Deniz sits next to the bed and looks at her, looking torn. His phone rings, he has to go to another fitting. He kneels down next to her, strokes her face and says "No more lying from now on."
7.) Vanessa is up and calls Deniz just as he comes into the door. She asks where he was. He says there was a fitting and he didn't want to wake her. She thinks that cute. She moves to kiss him, but he stops her and leads her to sit down. He says "I messed up" and then of course end o the episode.
Funniest line of the episode goes to Maximilian when he, Axel and Jenny agree to go to some publicity events and Maximilian says that he has to go and oil his hair first. Just craked me up.
Jenny is a creepy, creepy, creepy brotherstalking freak in this episode. It's icky (and I normally don't have that much of a problem with incest storylines).
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Post by Bonobochick on May 5, 2008 12:50:36 GMT -5
Okay, based on memory: 1.) Deniz flashed back to the kiss with Roman twice. Once when he saw Roman at the bar and once when Vanessa apologized that she was unfairly jelaous (of the models). 2.) Roman and some chick are drinking and commenting on the hotness or lack of of the guys in the bar. Deniz seems irritated. Has kiss flashback. Vanessa arrives (there is a funny scene where she pretends to be a an asking Deniz or an autograph). She says that she hasn't seen much of him in the last few days even though Jenny said their schedule wasn't that demanding and asks him what is up. Roman raises his eyebrows to Deniz, to me it looked like he was encouraging/daring Deniz to say it was because he kissed Roman. 3.) Deniz whimps out and says it's because of Marian and Nina. They both bitch about Nina. Vanessa assures him that everything will be fine. 4.) Deniz brings Roman the check and Roman hassles him a bit, giving him a huge tip which Deniz refuses, grabbing his hand which prompts Deniz to tell him to fuck off and he jokingly asks if he (Roman) doesn't get a good night kiss today. 5.) Deniz and Vanessa in bed together, naked. She jokes that she wants him just for his body. He pretends to be offended and says it's unfair that girls get to say that and men always get beat i they look after hot girls. She says looking it okay, touching isn't. Says she overreacted a bit about the thing with the models. Says she wonders whether he would rather be with one of those models. He says of course not. Vanessa says "Jealousy sucks, especially if there is no reason for it". Deniz flashes back to the kiss with Roman. 6.) Next morning. Vanessa is still asleep. Deniz sits next to the bed and looks at her, looking torn. His phone rings, he has to go to another fitting. He kneels down next to her, strokes her face and says "No more lying from now on." 7.) Vanessa is up and calls Deniz just as he comes into the door. She asks where he was. He says there was a fitting and he didn't want to wake her. She thinks that cute. She moves to kiss him, but he stops her and leads her to sit down. He says "I messed up" and then of course end o the episode. Funniest line of the episode goes to Maximilian when he, Axel and Jenny agree to go to some publicity events and Maximilian says that he has to go and oil his hair first. Just craked me up. Jenny is a creepy, creepy, creepy brotherstalking freak in this episode. It's icky (and I normally don't have that much of a problem with incest storylines). 1. Yay for flashbacks. I already figured he was pretty effected by the kiss with Roman so it's nice to see TIIC pretty much state that as well. 2. So Deniz hears Roman talk about other men and gets irritated by it. Awesome! Yet it makes me wonder why TIIC don't have Roman actively dating or attempting to find a new man when it's another angle of this story that they have yet to mine for goodies? Oy. 3. If nothing else, Deniz stays true to taking the easier route even if it is a bald faced lie. 4. There's the Roman I know and love! 5. MY EYES! MY EYES!! No naked DeVa. I love to look at Igor but it's not enough to compensate for that abomination. Another kiss flashback. Oh Deniz, you're nothing if not a hot mess emotionally. If Vanessa has said that was the best sex they'df ever had, it would have sealed the deal inmy mind that Deniz had to think of Roman to be passionate with her. Oh, and Vanessa, it's not those female models you need to worry about stealing Deniz away... 6. Deniz doesn't even talk a good game anymore. *sigh* 7. We'll I think those of us who read the spoilers know how that's going to turn out. Jenny is uber freaky when it comes to Max and I AM NOT A FAN OF INCEST. I really want to know who on AWZ's writing staff seems to have the incest hang-up cause it might be time for that individual to seek some therapy instead fo working it out using the show's characters.
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