firens
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Post by firens on Jun 10, 2011 5:26:15 GMT -5
something has happened, something tremendous, tremendous as in,,,,,, So, I wanted to post my translation of the scene before answering you, so that what I'll try to say might make a little more sense to more people. If I knew exactly what it is that happens, my name would be David, or Fer. But we get a clue from what David says he's missing, and from what transpires after that. The first thing to say is that David once again gives the lie to those who after all this time still think of him as stupid or insensitive. He takes Yoli's breath away as he starts talking, by revealing he's known all along what has been going on for two months. And he is not angry at her or at Fer, nor is he jealous. He is angry at himself, and desperate at what he feels are his own shortcomings and failings. David also implicitly solves the question of what it is we've been seeing for the whole chapter: Yoli has been living in the continued presence of Fer, she has been able to continue their conversation, and create a mental movie which we have visualised as through her own eyes. Which probably is why it had so many quasi comedic moments. Of course, the context of all this is crucial. What emerged in the final stretch of the Fervid story was that, rather than a matter of trust (as had been said so often), of talking to each other, etc..., the sole problem between Fer and David, once David had got his act together by the end of Season 4, was Fer's inability, probably from the start, to admit to himself and really accept that David loves him at least as much as he loves David. Another way of saying this would be that, in contrast with David, Fer has been unable to let himself be happy. It's by witnessing Toño's misery, and what it's driven him to, that Fer is able to finally understand what the problem is, and, by this very fact, to solve it. He says to Toño, but also to everybody else (and looking at David the whole time), talking about all the hardship he's suffered for coming out: "and you know what, Toño? In the end, it all became worth it because I met David... I met David, Toño...It's the best thing that's happened to me in my life..." This means, I think (and that's why David starts to cry then), that Fer finally says meeting David has changed his life (something David had been saying for the whole 6th season), and that's because, for the first time in his life, he was loved. So the whole time, Fer has had all he'd ever wanted. And the tragic realisation as he's dying, that he's wasted so much time leaves David with the unspeakable horror of a loss that's even more complete, more unbearable because they really had everything and were everything to each other. So what is David saying? That he has lost Fer entirely. That all the mementos he has are not enough. All the photos (those in that scrapbook, whose very existence was such a revelation to Fer in Season 6, like the revelation that David remembered his birthday), all the videos (I think he means the videos you find by searching on you tube for the words Fer+David), it's all useless. That's what everyone has. That's not what only Fer and he had: the caresses, the infinite inflections of Fer's voice talking to him, Fer saying to him "I love you". So at the very moment we're slipping into meta territory, and the FerVid story could seem to have only existed in its representation, that's when we're reminded or made to understand these are two real boys in love and we viewers can have no real idea of what that is or was. All the FerVid clips in the world are simulacra, the real thing escapes us. So this is one first redpill moment, right there. The superior, or more accurate, reality David finds miraculously access to, is in his head. For me, beside the fact that Fer never talks to David during the sequence, the telling detail is that, after opening his eyes to the so longed for vision of Fer standing in front of him, David closes them again, when Fer touches his cheek and is about to kiss him. The explosion visualised by the FerVid montage is only a visual equivalent of the complete sensory experience the kiss triggers. David recovers everything. But Fer is still dead, and his absence is even more unbearable now and David keeps crying as his beloved walks away. We'll have to see where 77 will take all this.
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jos87
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Post by jos87 on Jun 10, 2011 7:24:57 GMT -5
beautiful words firens;and excellent and deep analysis about what we have seen.And it's really true the fact that David shows that he is not stupid and insensitive (like many thought,for exemple,in some spanish forums,at the end of chapter 75 when they saw David kissing that boy in the advance);but i always thought that David is not stupid and that he always loved Fer (in Season 6 he said more than once that he and Fer were born to be together)at the same way Fer loved him. However i think that David is just a little angry with Fer,but only for a reason,or maybe he want to be angry with him (maybe to justify the fact that he can't "see" his Fer):because Fer said to him that he never would abandoned him,while with his death is like he did [Yoli : I don't know, do you think there is a part of you that doesn't want to remember him ?... Are you angry at him? David : He told me he would never leave me.];but this is something that many people think when they lost someone important in their life;is one of the way to react to the death. But later,thanks to Yoli's words he understand that if Fer had been able to decide,he would be always near to David;he never would abandoned his love. But,like you said,he is more angry with himself; and not with Yoli for the strange "friendship" that in these 2 mounths she had with her best friend.About the fact that he knew about what happened in these 2 mounth between Yoli and "Fer" is well visible in many scenes where we can see that David understand that Yoli is talking, in her way, to Fer (when they are in the computer room or when they are in class and Yoli "talk" and "look" to Fer when for example Fer raises his hands to reply to the teacher;David's face shows this). However the last scene break my heart. I really love the last part of your post: So at the very moment we're slipping into meta territory, and the FerVid story could seem to have only existed in its representation, that's when we're reminded or made to understand these are two real boys in love and we viewers can have no real idea of what that is or was. All the FerVid clips in the world are simulacra, the real thing escapes us. So this is one first redpill moment, right there. The superior, or more accurate, reality David finds miraculously access to, is in his head. For me, beside the fact that Fer never talks to David during the sequence, the telling detail is that, after opening his eyes to the so longed for vision of Fer standing in front of him, David closes them again, when Fer touches his cheek and is about to kiss him. The explosion visualised by the FerVid montage is only a visual equivalent of the complete sensory experience the kiss triggers. David recovers everything. But Fer is still dead, and his absence is even more unbearable now and David keeps crying as his beloved walks away. clap clap
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Post by dots80 on Jun 10, 2011 9:19:52 GMT -5
So are we supposed to be feeling bad for John and Alvaro? Cuz' I could care less about them at this point. I find it kind of Ironic that David's story arc ends with John (the actor whom Adrian Rodriguez beat out for the role of David) ;D
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bahnree
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Post by bahnree on Jun 10, 2011 9:54:14 GMT -5
So are we supposed to be feeling bad for John and Alvaro? Cuz' I could care less about them at this point. I find it kind of Ironic that David's story arc ends with John (the actor whom Adrian Rodriguez beat out for the role of David) ;D [It's "I couldn't care less." If you COULD care less, that means you actually do care, a little bit, because you could care less. I really don't mean to be snobby.] I totally agree though. It's kinda unfortunate how unlikeable those characters are at this point. I wanted to care about Alvaro in S6, but he just never did anything that made me do so. Now it's just really too late. Jon is maybe in a bit better position, because of his friendship with Salva and his current repentance, but....*shrug*
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Liana
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Post by Liana on Jun 10, 2011 10:22:43 GMT -5
Wow... imagine Jon as David... hmmm.........
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Post by Duskysoda on Jun 10, 2011 11:00:22 GMT -5
So, I wanted to post my translation of the scene before answering you, so that what I'll try to say might make a little more sense to more people. If I knew exactly what it is that happens, my name would be David, or Fer. But we get a clue from what David says he's missing, and from what transpires after that. The first thing to say is that David once again gives the lie to those who after all this time still think of him as stupid or insensitive. He takes Yoli's breath away as he starts talking, by revealing he's known all along what has been going on for two months. And he is not angry at her or at Fer, nor is he jealous. He is angry at himself, and desperate at what he feels are his own shortcomings and failings. David also implicitly solves the question of what it is we've been seeing for the whole chapter: Yoli has been living in the continued presence of Fer, she has been able to continue their conversation, and create a mental movie which we have visualised as through her own eyes. Which probably is why it had so many quasi comedic moments. Of course, the context of all this is crucial. What emerged in the final stretch of the Fervid story was that, rather than a matter of trust (as had been said so often), of talking to each other, etc..., the sole problem between Fer and David, once David had got his act together by the end of Season 4, was Fer's inability, probably from the start, to admit to himself and really accept that David loves him at least as much as he loves David. Another way of saying this would be that, in contrast with David, Fer has been unable to let himself be happy. It's by witnessing Toño's misery, and what it's driven him to, that Fer is able to finally understand what the problem is, and, by this very fact, to solve it. He says to Toño, but also to everybody else (and looking at David the whole time), talking about all the hardship he's suffered for coming out: "and you know what, Toño? In the end, it all became worth it because I met David... I met David, Toño...It's the best thing that's happened to me in my life..." This means, I think (and that's why David starts to cry then), that Fer finally says meeting David has changed his life (something David had been saying for the whole 6th season), and that's because, for the first time in his life, he was loved. So the whole time, Fer has had all he'd ever wanted. And the tragic realisation as he's dying, that he's wasted so much time leaves David with the unspeakable horror of a loss that's even more complete, more unbearable because they really had everything and were everything to each other. So what is David saying? That he has lost Fer entirely. That all the mementos he has are not enough. All the photos (those in that scrapbook, whose very existence was such a revelation to Fer in Season 6, like the revelation that David remembered his birthday), all the videos (I think he means the videos you find by searching on you tube for the words Fer+David), it's all useless. That's what everyone has. That's not what only Fer and he had: the caresses, the infinite inflections of Fer's voice talking to him, Fer saying to him "I love you". So at the very moment we're slipping into meta territory, and the FerVid story could seem to have only existed in its representation, that's when we're reminded or made to understand these are two real boys in love and we viewers can have no real idea of what that is or was. All the FerVid clips in the world are simulacra, the real thing escapes us. So this is one first redpill moment, right there. The superior, or more accurate, reality David finds miraculously access to, is in his head. For me, beside the fact that Fer never talks to David during the sequence, the telling detail is that, after opening his eyes to the so longed for vision of Fer standing in front of him, David closes them again, when Fer touches his cheek and is about to kiss him. The explosion visualised by the FerVid montage is only a visual equivalent of the complete sensory experience the kiss triggers. David recovers everything. But Fer is still dead, and his absence is even more unbearable now and David keeps crying as his beloved walks away. Thanks for all the effort you put in to answering my question!
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jos87
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Post by jos87 on Jun 10, 2011 11:08:40 GMT -5
Wow... imagine Jon as David... hmmm......... i prefer Adrian as David. The actor who plays Jon is a cute guy and a good actor;but Adrian for me is on another planet! However, i remember that was the actor who plays Roman to have to play David,not Jon.But for problems connected to the age he couldn't.luckily for my opinion.
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Liana
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Post by Liana on Jun 10, 2011 13:13:50 GMT -5
If Jon were David Fervid would look like this!
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Shiny
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Post by Shiny on Jun 10, 2011 14:53:10 GMT -5
They both (Nasser and Alex) were auditioned for the role of David.
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firens
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Post by firens on Jun 10, 2011 15:02:24 GMT -5
And according to what Javier explained last year, once Adrián had been auditioned, there was no hesitation as to who was going to get the part.
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jos87
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Post by jos87 on Jun 10, 2011 18:24:12 GMT -5
thanks shiny for the clarification. And according to what Javier explained last year, once Adrián had been auditioned, there was no hesitation as to who was going to get the part. and we don't have any doubt about this Adrian is perfect as David and Adrian+Javier give to us one this amazing love story
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Post by Duskysoda on Jun 10, 2011 20:24:35 GMT -5
I am noticing several happy endings listed by Firens in the spoiler posts section... Julio/Cova,, etc. But Fer and David.....they take an unjustifiable path. Though I hate they did it.... kudos to Adrian, Javi and the actress playing Yoli for doing a tremendous job making a horrible storyline choice powerful and emotional and one for the memory book!
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firens
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Post by firens on Jun 10, 2011 20:56:24 GMT -5
As you know, the choice of the writers doesn't make me happy at all. But, about those (heterosexual) happy ends, you understand, no doubt, they are just jokes: "Blanca" is making up a hilarious tale of how she got back with Berto, "Paula" and "Gorka" are supposing that, yes, since they come together to the finale, they must still be together, and "Cova" dreams up a kind of unlikely symbiosis which explains why she's still together with Julio. Plus, these are cameos, meaning they most probably won't have lines in the episode.
So, yes, Fer's death is still as unacceptable as ever, but it is just as true that Fervid is the only valid love story in the show.
PS: I guess I didn't put this in my summary of Javi's videochat, but he made it clear that his character was always meant to appear in the season's finale, originally chapter 79. And not just as archive footage. So I don't know how much screen time Fer will have in this rewritten finale, now chapter 77, but we know he's there.
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bahnree
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Post by bahnree on Jun 11, 2011 17:37:13 GMT -5
I wonder why, at the end of that preview (the one with Javier mentioning the special), they re-show clips from 7x05? Kinda a random choice? No?
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firens
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Post by firens on Jun 11, 2011 22:21:00 GMT -5
Well, it's been the most talked about episode in the whole season, so it sort of makes sense.
This is what we know. Carlos Ruano, who's the one who tweeted about that "special" mentioned he was going through old scripts and stories, and "writing questions". I would imagine there is going to be quite a generous selection of archive footage from all seasons of the show. (And we know Quintas is using shots of 1x01 in chapter 77.) Javier Calvo will play host, which may mean he'll be the one asking questions from the others. Everything will be on the Zurbarán set.
So maybe this will be like a guided tour of the set, with each corner being brought to life again with memories of major scenes having taken place in specific parts of the set.
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firens
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Post by firens on Jun 12, 2011 18:31:23 GMT -5
The Irene story is really good, and very Ireneish ;D Too bad though they didn't bring back Mark Schardan (Thomas). I rather liked him. Anyway, it confirms what I was saying: none of those "happy endings" is meant to be taken seriously.
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margie
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Post by margie on Jun 13, 2011 6:34:44 GMT -5
The latest spoiler clip kind of reminds me of when Cova convinces everyone to chain themselves in protest of Jan's father.
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firens
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Post by firens on Jun 13, 2011 14:28:57 GMT -5
So I was hoping that the writers would speak out. Something has come out. It's not quite as explicit as I would like but it is certainly a beginning. On this website, an interview with Carlos Ruano Lebrón, screenplay coordinator and head writer with Jaime Vaca since 2009, both part of the team originally put together by Carlos Montero in 2007. The interviewer was Borja Terán. blogs.lainformacion.com/telediaria/2011/06/13/final-fisica-o-quimica-antena-3/(and the official website has linked to it and provided a summary here: www.antena3.com/series/fisica-o-quimica/noticias/foq-podra-continuar-neox_2011061300165.htmlCarlos Ruano, FoQ screenplay coordinator, reveals the keys to the end of the teenage showHow will go the shutting down of the Zurbarán? What's the future for teenage shows? Shall we "burn from inside" in the farewell of Física o Química? Carlos Ruano, FoQ screenplay coordinator, tells us the behind-the-scenes of the farewell of the show. Q: Física o Química finishes today. How does a show which started out daringly with a teen suicide end its run? A: Tonight, we'll live an adieu with strong emotional potential, particularly for the fans. Beside that, after the final episode, Javier Calvo will host a special where all the actors who've been part of the show will go over the best moments we've had in Física o Química. It will be very moving. Q: This show has suffered a loss of audience. To what extent does the screenwriter feel guilty? A: Antena 3 has taken great care of the product, they unflinchingly believed in the stories Física o Química was telling. They've always supported the show, and that's what is the most important. They even went in for the gamble that was having a gay couple as protagonist of the series. But in the end, a screenwriter always has to work in a balancing act, between what he likes, what the channel likes and what the audience likes. That's all there is to it. Q: Did you write the famous line "I would burn from inside"? that's become common usage. [That happened in 6x13] A: I didn't, it was my colleague Jaime. The repetition of that line in a loop felt like it lasted forever (it was a glitch of the broadcasting service) and that's one of those things where you say "Why me, God?" Q: What's true about Neox making an adapted version of the series, taking advantage of the FoQ franchise? A: It seems smart to me that DT should receive a kickstart and stop broadcasting canned products. Neox is a channel that's been conceived for teenagers, and Antena 3 doesn't want to waste such an established brand as Física o Química. We'll try to continue on Neox with the essence of the show, but the cast will be entirely renewed. We'll do it following the direction of the last few seasons when the show became much more stylised. Q: Do you pay attention to foreign shows as transgressive as the British Skins, which are very raw when it comes to dealing with teenagers? A: I haven't followed Skins much. What I've seen seems too exaggerated to me. You don't need to show reality so extremely crude every minute of a show. You can put in a "wild" storyline, but it always has to adhere to some "truth" of the characters. They may have crazy things happen to them, but they should always behave like real people. And that's what I always miss in Skins, where the characters always respond to everything in such an unreal way that I don't believe it. Q: How do you see the future of high school shows? Are they burned out? A: Absolutely not. They have the same future as doctors' shows, lawyers' shows, or any other genre. High school shows will evolve, and will reinvent themselves. In order to make Física o Química, we paid a lot of attention to real stories, and we realised that it's not a cliché that sometimes reality is stronger than fiction. We didn't replicate Compañeros, where everything was set in an atmosphere with too much good vibe, we tried to show how are the lives of teenagers, taking cues and facts from today's social reality. Q: So on which team were you as a viewer? Compañeros, Al salir de clase or Nada es para siempre? A: I wasn't a big follower of any of the three. A bit more Al salir de clase [that was the one with the ground-breaking gay storyline]. Even though, before I started writing for Física o Química, I watched them all to see what had been done so far. I was always more of the mood of Es mi vida (aired by Canal Plus in Spain). Q: The finale really got started with the death of one the show's most emblematic protagonists. How do you decide which character to kill? A: In fact, the ending is decided because he wanted to go. Javi Calvo had decided to leave the show, and we looked for the best ending for his character, the most worthy and emotional farewell. Now it just happened that the show got cancelled just two chapters after Fer's death. But it was a coincidence, not a coup de théâtre following a departure. Q: Which anecdote would you stay with out of all those years in FoQ? A: There have been lots of anecdotes. And I don't know if I can tell them... (laughs) I'll stay with one from the early days of production of this new season, when the actors who were playing football destroyed a glass door. The shoot had to be stopped until we could replace the glass. This is stuff that happens when you work with teenagers. Q: The end of a show you would have liked to write? A: I admit, I would have loved to write the ending of Buffy. Even if I would have been criticised for it... (laughs) Q: And now what? What would you like to do after Física o Química ? A: We're waiting to find out if the projected FoQ sequel on Neox will go forward. And now, I'm waiting to get a call from a friend. Because I don't know if you know, but us screenwriters, we depend a lot on friends remembering you when new projects come up. For this reason, with a group of screenwriting friends, we'll try to start a webseries in which will collaborate various writers from FoQ, Hospital central, Cuestión de Sexo... and in which will play actors like Leonor Martín and Álex Martínez. I've also directed a short called Turno de Noche ("Night Shift", with Adam Jeziersky and Israel Rodríguez) that's beginning to play on the festival circuit; we've already been picked up by five.... Q: Surely, you'll watch the last episode tonight? What will you do when it airs? A: Of course, I never miss one, in fact when we're talking of special chapters like this one, we usually all make a date to meet, have dinner somewhere... and as this is the fiinal chapter, I imagine we'll get a little drunk. What we'll surely do as well, will be to tweet live as we are watching. We've found out Twitter is great to get instant feedback from the fans of the show.
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jos87
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Post by jos87 on Jun 13, 2011 16:58:58 GMT -5
thanks for the interview. And like you,firens,i hoped for something more explicit. But maybe the following days will read something more from them. However if someone saw the episode can write here his/her own impressions,opinions? I have to wait,i don't know how much, to see this chapter;so i'd like to read what you think about this chapter
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Post by carmelabcn on Jun 13, 2011 17:09:06 GMT -5
Well, it seems a happy end with all the couples together. Yoli and Salva, Alma and Alvaro, Teresa and Roman, Vero and Xavi, Sara and Vaquero (in Argentina); Jon has forgiven himself and be forgiven by David, with of course his couple dead... And it's amazing what everybody said theZurbaran has been for them. David said it's the place where he found his way, or somethin similar. And now is the goodbye.
Oh, very beautiful, everybody of the past seasons has arrived; and David hold the hands with Jon. And now Fer kisses David and then, Yoli says:Now, we are all!
I like it! (and, at the end, Vaquero has had a good story!)
Now, Javi Calvo is interviewing the actresses and actors.
Ah, Shiny, there are images of the Russian version!
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jos87
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Post by jos87 on Jun 13, 2011 17:43:17 GMT -5
thanks carmela for the info.So Fer will be seen by David and Yoli or only from Yoli ? (because in the advance seemed to me that David feels the Fer's presence). Hope that Adrian will be interviewed because is a gift for us Fervidistas to see them talking about their Characters and their relationship in FoQ.
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Shiny
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Post by Shiny on Jun 13, 2011 17:46:11 GMT -5
carmelabcn, we have started subbing Russian promo already.
But this was the first time I saw that exact scene.
"Cova" is blond, ha-ha..
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firens
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Post by firens on Jun 13, 2011 17:47:59 GMT -5
Yes, so the special is now gone to commercial break. The real title was in fact " Lo que hemos vivido" ("the things we've lived") which is a line from the title song by Despistaos. So far, it's been Andrea Duro, Sandra Blázquez, Gonzalo Ramos and Angy Fernández, interviewed by Javi Calvo. Archive footage from the show, and also from the gala premieres, plus exclusive material from the early casting sessions. I think Javi is really excellent as host. Let's see what's still to come.
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Post by carmelabcn on Jun 13, 2011 17:48:02 GMT -5
JOS87: Yes, Fer is felt by David (that has his eyes closed, feeling him) and seen by Yoly. I wait the interview with Adrian.
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Shiny
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Post by Shiny on Jun 13, 2011 17:48:37 GMT -5
In Russia everyone is sitting now and waiting for Adrian. But I personally doubt that we'll see him (but still hope!) P.S. This was the first time we collected some statistics. There were 180 russians watching online
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