dalia
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Max & Iago Forever
Posts: 387
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Post by dalia on Jul 25, 2014 19:15:19 GMT -5
yeah, i'll believe it when i see it. i have absolutely no trust in Davis.
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Post by sunshine0786 on Jul 25, 2014 19:55:44 GMT -5
yeah, i'll believe it when i see it. i have absolutely no trust in Davis. That was my thought exactly.
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dmagiclight
Full Member
OPEN YOUR MIND AND ANY THING IS CAN HAPPEN
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Post by dmagiclight on Jul 26, 2014 3:25:46 GMT -5
What I find so Interesting is Jeff has all different supernatural creatures all races and male and female but not one of them are gay/lesbian/bi or transgender In fact yet here we have one more straight character promoted to series regular and yet one more gay best friend who is barely there as A out gay man I feel Jeff is doing LGBT COMMUNITY A DESERVES BY HIS REFUSING TO PUT A LGBT CHARACTER ON THE MAIN CAST I will give him a pass on the whole Stiles bisexual thing I do that may have had to do more with the actor not wanting to play that role,yes they said Danny will be back but I bet he will be in one or two episodes and no more then 2 mins on screen and It will be for his character to be killed off or to say goodbye Jeff has lied and queer baited for 3 seasons now and plays up to the straight audience I feel he owes the LGBT COMMUNITY there due
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Post by jjose712 on Jul 26, 2014 5:46:14 GMT -5
But the worse thing is that he can play for a straight audience and having a gay main character at the same time without any problem. It's a large cast, it's not risky at all.
Sorry, but i think he has some kind of inferiority complex, all the gay characters are sidekicks and exist only because their straight friend exist. And it's not the only case, there are a good bunch of gay head writers in hit shows are absolutely unable to bring a gay character to their shows (no matter how big is the cast).
And it's not the first time that the first in advicing gay actor to not come out are directors or producers that are openly gay themselves.
I said it before, but in my opinion the straight head writer of Spartacus has more guts and defended his gay characters way more than any of head writers that like to promote theis shows on gay sites and press. His show was aimed to basically straight male audiences, he received backlash from some viewers and he gave them the big middle finger and continue to introduce gay character in his show (and hire gay actors in straight roles too).
Frankly i think most of this gay writers want it all for nothing, want promotion of their shows without taking a minimum risk, and in Davis case it wouldn't even been a risk to have a gay main character. And the worse part is they continue to promote the show as gay frienly (and yes, the show is gay friendly if you don't mind token gay characters) and talking about gay storylines. If at least they have the decency to shut up it will be less annoying. Obviously now he is aware of the deception of the fans and he said what he thinks they want to hear, but he is as believable as he was when he said that Danny will get a bigger role. Given how little he gives to his gay characters it will needed at least six gay characters to get a decent screem time between all of them
I hope Keahu gets a role in another show that treats him with a little more respect (and that won't be difficult)
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Post by kevvoi on Aug 29, 2014 15:33:15 GMT -5
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Post by jjose712 on Sept 9, 2014 8:37:11 GMT -5
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dalia
Junior Member
Max & Iago Forever
Posts: 387
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Post by dalia on Sept 9, 2014 13:14:02 GMT -5
The article/interview/PR stunt was so laughable. But the comments were amazing.
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Post by moonstruck-me on Sept 9, 2014 16:48:05 GMT -5
How can the actors think that the show is so inclusive of gay characters?? I guess they don't watch the show either...
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Post by jjose712 on Sept 10, 2014 0:22:54 GMT -5
I don't blame the actors, probably the have to say what they are told to promote the show. Anyway, if they are smart they will stop doing this, because the backlash of the show could easily translate in backlash to the actors.
The show is a guilty pleassure so stop doing this, because they only thing they get is making people angry. The show is not inclusive in any way, wich is a pity because they have a gay writer and it's clearly a show were full inclusion can be done without any problem.
Jeff decided his gay characters are token ones, so let thing there, but trying to fool people is not working, and in the long run is not doing them any favour
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Post by moonstruck-me on Sept 10, 2014 16:29:15 GMT -5
I don't blame the actors, probably the have to say what they are told to promote the show. Anyway, if they are smart they will stop doing this, because the backlash of the show could easily translate in backlash to the actors. The show is a guilty pleassure so stop doing this, because they only thing they get is making people angry. The show is not inclusive in any way, wich is a pity because they have a gay writer and it's clearly a show were full inclusion can be done without any problem. Jeff decided his gay characters are token ones, so let thing there, but trying to fool people is not working, and in the long run is not doing them any favourYou can say that again. I think there's a reason for the dropping viewer numbers.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2014 16:47:57 GMT -5
I think the reason viewers dropped is that the past two season the show has gotten away from what made it popular in the first place. The show used to be driven by the characters relationships with one another. Now it's mainly who will this weeks killer try to kill and will Scott and the gang be able to stop them.
But I think they have a real good chance to return the show to how it was if they don't blow it. The scenes in the finale with Scott and Liam really showed a connection between them. Liam brought Scott back from being a Berserker and then when Scott saw Liam was in danger he transformed into a real badass and kicked Peter's butt. I really want to see them explore their relationship next season with Scott mentoring Liam.
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Post by moonstruck-me on Sept 10, 2014 16:56:29 GMT -5
I think the reason viewers dropped is that the past two season the show has gotten away from what made it popular in the first place. The show used to be driven by the characters relationships with one another. Now it's mainly who will this weeks killer try to kill and will Scott and the gang be able to stop them. But I think they have a real good chance to return the show to how it was if they don't blow it. The scenes in the finale with Scott and Liam really showed a connection between them. Liam brought Scott back from being a Berserker and then when Scott saw Liam was in danger he transformed into a real badass and kicked Peter's butt. I really want to see them explore their relationship next season with Scott mentoring Liam. I know Danny and lack of lgbt characters isn't the only reason for viewers dropping out. The problem is Jeff Davis and his horrible writing skills. You really care about Liam and Scott? I couldn't care less about any of the new characters. The problem is that Davis ignores the characters from the first seasons, the characters that viewers - and fans - love. Season 4 was supposed to be about Lydia... how was that? The show isn't character driven but it should be. That's Davis' biggest mistake. He don't want to listen to his fans.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2014 17:09:46 GMT -5
Well I'd rather watch Scott mentoring Liam or Scott's bromance with Stiles then watch Scott with his new gf.
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dalia
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Max & Iago Forever
Posts: 387
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Post by dalia on Sept 10, 2014 18:35:19 GMT -5
honestly i quit watching Teen Wolf halfway through this season. i always said i would stick with it as long as Dylan O'Brien was on but then it began to be a chore to watch every week. i kept reading recaps, and it looked like i made the right decision to drop it.
i hope the next season will be the last, i pity most of the actors in this show now.
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Post by moonstruck-me on Sept 11, 2014 15:28:52 GMT -5
Well I'd rather watch Scott mentoring Liam or Scott's bromance with Stiles then watch Scott with his new gf. Same, even though Scott is such a boring character... (getting him a new girlfriend didn't help at all). honestly i quit watching Teen Wolf halfway through this season. i always said i would stick with it as long as Dylan O'Brien was on but then it began to be a chore to watch every week. i kept reading recaps, and it looked like i made the right decision to drop it. i hope the next season will be the last, i pity most of the actors in this show now. I thought I would be hanging around to watch TW because of Dylan and Hoechlin, but after season 3B I'd had enough. I was always getting really frustrated after an episode because nothing "good" ever happened. Davis doesn't really care about his characters. It seems like every season (after season 2) all he cares about is how many villains he can squeeze together in 12 episodes and get some great slow motion, action scenes. For a show with (some) amazing characters, Davis has failed big time. Another thing that angers me is all the lies they keep telling the fans. Didn't Davis say Danny would show up? ...At least he kept us believing he would. I read somewhere the ratings have dropped 17% from last season. Like you, dalia, I hope Davis will get his shit together fast or that the show gets cancelled after next season (or now). The actors definitely deserve better.
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dalia
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Max & Iago Forever
Posts: 387
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Post by dalia on Sept 11, 2014 21:07:13 GMT -5
I thought I would be hanging around to watch TW because of Dylan and Hoechlin, but after season 3B I'd had enough. I was always getting really frustrated after an episode because nothing "good" ever happened. Davis doesn't really care about his characters. It seems like every season (after season 2) all he cares about is how many villains he can squeeze together in 12 episodes and get some great slow motion, action scenes. For a show with (some) amazing characters, Davis has failed big time. Another thing that angers me is all the lies they keep telling the fans. Didn't Davis say Danny would show up? ...At least he kept us believing he would. I read somewhere the ratings have dropped 17% from last season. Like you, dalia, I hope Davis will get his shit together fast or that the show gets cancelled after next season (or now). The actors definitely deserve better. not only does Davis not care about his characters, he doesn't care about the audience who watches his show. the ones who are passionate and the reason he is even getting a 5th season. i'm not saying he should completely give in to what the fandom wants - but for him to listen would be nice. the man has no complete vision for this show. he has no show bible, no timeline, he's just making shit up as he goes along and he ran it into the ground. this show wasn't ever great, but it was fun and made you care about the characters. look what he's done to it. Derek is barely a main character anymore, he has no interaction with Stiles because of the popularity of Sterek, he shoves new characters at us telling us we'll love them (Malia) instead of giving other more established characters a real story (Lydia), PoC drop like flies, women don't fare much better, plots don't even make sense anymore or you don't even remember things that happened (the alpha pack's purpose? anyone?). i knew when Davis said "we're not done with Danny yet" that Danny wasn't going to show up in Season 4, because Season 4 was already done and Holland said he wasn't around. maybe he'll throw him in Season 5, but he won't have a substantial role. he'll get to stand on the sidelines with Mason. the sad thing is that fan fiction is so much better than the actual show.
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Post by jjose712 on Sept 12, 2014 0:22:39 GMT -5
To be fair he said we didn't see the last of Danny, wich could mean a lot of things. Maybe he'll be back in season five to die five minutes after.
When Posey said that TW was like Buffy but with more heart he must be drunk for sure
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Teen Wolf
Sept 12, 2014 5:47:34 GMT -5
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Post by Difficult Diva on Sept 12, 2014 5:47:34 GMT -5
I thought I would be hanging around to watch TW because of Dylan and Hoechlin, but after season 3B I'd had enough. I was always getting really frustrated after an episode because nothing "good" ever happened. Davis doesn't really care about his characters. It seems like every season (after season 2) all he cares about is how many villains he can squeeze together in 12 episodes and get some great slow motion, action scenes. For a show with (some) amazing characters, Davis has failed big time. Another thing that angers me is all the lies they keep telling the fans. Didn't Davis say Danny would show up? ...At least he kept us believing he would. I read somewhere the ratings have dropped 17% from last season. Like you, dalia, I hope Davis will get his shit together fast or that the show gets cancelled after next season (or now). The actors definitely deserve better. not only does Davis not care about his characters, he doesn't care about the audience who watches his show. the ones who are passionate and the reason he is even getting a 5th season. i'm not saying he should completely give in to what the fandom wants - but for him to listen would be nice. the man has no complete vision for this show. he has no show bible, no timeline, he's just making shit up as he goes along and he ran it into the ground. this show wasn't ever great, but it was fun and made you care about the characters. look what he's done to it. Derek is barely a main character anymore, he has no interaction with Stiles because of the popularity of Sterek, he shoves new characters at us telling us we'll love them (Malia) instead of giving other more established characters a real story (Lydia), PoC drop like flies, women don't fare much better, plots don't even make sense anymore or you don't even remember things that happened (the alpha pack's purpose? anyone?). i knew when Davis said "we're not done with Danny yet" that Danny wasn't going to show up in Season 4, because Season 4 was already done and Holland said he wasn't around. maybe he'll throw him in Season 5, but he won't have a substantial role. he'll get to stand on the sidelines with Mason. the sad thing is that fan fiction is so much better than the actual show. Davis does have a "vision" for his show. It's just a vision that is not at all what a certain segment of the online fandom wants to see. Or has finally admitted in what they only want to see. I personally feel that certain folks allowed themselves to be duped, because they played along in the "will they/won't they game" with Davis, O'Brien, Hochhlin and the other castmates of TW about Sterek and did not realize that it was just a game. The show was and will never go there with Sterek or Stiles coming out as bisexual. Especially after season two. Davis, as the series producer knew about the chemistry between Stiles and Derek and still didn't get inspired about it at all. That should have been caught by everyone that nothing Sterek was going to happen. The character of Derek, from what I've seen was never supposed to always be a main character. Especially over drawing focus away from Scott character, whose character is what Teen Wolf was created around. All the arguments/issues about the female characters, characters of color and lack of gay, lesbian and bi characters has always been there since season one, but everything was "fine" as long as there also was a scene of Derek pushing Stiles into some lockers or Stiles saying something idiotic about Derek, boys finding him attractive or Danny saying some throwaway line about his sexuality (to make sure to keep viewers up to date that he was gay). Yet, this time it's just too much, because the show stopped having scenes between Derek with Stiles and Danny disappearing? I get that certain folks are pissed, but don't lay all the blame on MTV, Davis and not on the actors (especially Tyler Posey - who some folks act like he's the Devil Incarnate). Let's see if the show doesn't get renewed after this next upcoming season, because it did get renewed, right at the height of all this online fandom drama/fallout. Because there are viewers still watching this show. Much more than those in the online fandom.
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Post by moonstruck-me on Sept 12, 2014 6:55:23 GMT -5
not only does Davis not care about his characters, he doesn't care about the audience who watches his show. the ones who are passionate and the reason he is even getting a 5th season. i'm not saying he should completely give in to what the fandom wants - but for him to listen would be nice. the man has no complete vision for this show. he has no show bible, no timeline, he's just making shit up as he goes along and he ran it into the ground. this show wasn't ever great, but it was fun and made you care about the characters. look what he's done to it. Derek is barely a main character anymore, he has no interaction with Stiles because of the popularity of Sterek, he shoves new characters at us telling us we'll love them (Malia) instead of giving other more established characters a real story (Lydia), PoC drop like flies, women don't fare much better, plots don't even make sense anymore or you don't even remember things that happened (the alpha pack's purpose? anyone?). i knew when Davis said "we're not done with Danny yet" that Danny wasn't going to show up in Season 4, because Season 4 was already done and Holland said he wasn't around. maybe he'll throw him in Season 5, but he won't have a substantial role. he'll get to stand on the sidelines with Mason. the sad thing is that fan fiction is so much better than the actual show. Davis does have a "vision" for his show. It's just a vision that is not at all what a certain segment of the online fandom wants to see. Or has finally admitted in what they only want to see. I personally feel that certain folks allowed themselves to be duped, because they played along in the "will they/won't they game" with Davis, O'Brien, Hochhlin and the other castmates of TW about Sterek and did not realize that it was just a game. The show was and will never go there with Sterek or Stiles coming out as bisexual. Especially after season two. Davis, as the series producer knew about the chemistry between Stiles and Derek and still didn't get inspired about it at all. That should have been caught by everyone that nothing Sterek was going to happen. The character of Derek, from what I've seen was never supposed to always be a main character. Especially over drawing focus away from Scott character, whose character is what Teen Wolf was created around. All the arguments/issues about the female characters, characters of color and lack of gay, lesbian and bi characters has always been there since season one, but everything was "fine" as long as there also was a scene of Derek pushing Stiles into some lockers or Stiles saying something idiotic about Derek, boys finding him attractive or Danny saying some throwaway line about his sexuality (to make sure to keep viewers up to date that he was gay). Yet, this time it's just too much, because the show stopped having scenes between Derek with Stiles and Danny disappearing? I get that certain folks are pissed, but don't lay all the blame on MTV, Davis and not on the actors (especially Tyler Posey - who some folks act like he's the Devil Incarnate).Let's see if the show doesn't get renewed after this next upcoming season, because it did get renewed, right at the height of all this online fandom drama/fallout. Because there are viewers still watching this show. Much more than those in the online fandom. Please enlighten me of Davis' vision for TW, because I would really like to know. I understand there is a pretty big fandom of TW and the biggest ship out there is definitely Sterek. I do ship them and definitely kept watching season 3B because of them but that wasn't the only reason I stopped watching. Davis doesn't understand the concept of a timeline. He creates great characters (all the main ones and like Erica, Boyd and Isaac) but doesn't really write for them. How many actors have left since season 2? A lot of them and I would guess the biggest reason is they have nothing good to do on the show and that's kind of sad for a writer who keeps introducing new characters on his show. The fandom doesn't only care about Sterek, they love a lot of the other characters as well. I didn't stop watching season 4 because there wasn't any Sterek or Danny - I haven't watched the season at all, so how could I have known that beforehand? I just think a lot of fans have come to a kind of breaking point with the show and either you learn to live with how Davis like his show or you stop watching and do something else with your time. I get that Davis doesn't want to make Sterek canon - and that's fine - but he should've thought about what he was doing and stopped baiting the fans with it. And for the sentence I highlighted; if MTV, Davis and the actors (I don't really blame the actors that much but whatever) who should people blame then? Themselves? Not the person who writes the show or the network that keeps baiting the fans with Sterek? (they are still doing it)... I understand that a show runner/writer shouldn't listen to everything the fandom wants (that wouldn't even be possible) but it's a bad idea to treat them like they're stupid and not care a little of what they like about the show. Imo. It's the fans who secure good ratings after all. But yeah, I'll guess we see what happens after season 5...
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Teen Wolf
Sept 12, 2014 19:33:18 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Difficult Diva on Sept 12, 2014 19:33:18 GMT -5
Davis does have a "vision" for his show. It's just a vision that is not at all what a certain segment of the online fandom wants to see. Or has finally admitted in what they only want to see. I personally feel that certain folks allowed themselves to be duped, because they played along in the "will they/won't they game" with Davis, O'Brien, Hochhlin and the other castmates of TW about Sterek and did not realize that it was just a game. The show was and will never go there with Sterek or Stiles coming out as bisexual. Especially after season two. Davis, as the series producer knew about the chemistry between Stiles and Derek and still didn't get inspired about it at all. That should have been caught by everyone that nothing Sterek was going to happen. The character of Derek, from what I've seen was never supposed to always be a main character. Especially over drawing focus away from Scott character, whose character is what Teen Wolf was created around. All the arguments/issues about the female characters, characters of color and lack of gay, lesbian and bi characters has always been there since season one, but everything was "fine" as long as there also was a scene of Derek pushing Stiles into some lockers or Stiles saying something idiotic about Derek, boys finding him attractive or Danny saying some throwaway line about his sexuality (to make sure to keep viewers up to date that he was gay). Yet, this time it's just too much, because the show stopped having scenes between Derek with Stiles and Danny disappearing? I get that certain folks are pissed, but don't lay all the blame on MTV, Davis and not on the actors (especially Tyler Posey - who some folks act like he's the Devil Incarnate).Let's see if the show doesn't get renewed after this next upcoming season, because it did get renewed, right at the height of all this online fandom drama/fallout. Because there are viewers still watching this show. Much more than those in the online fandom. I have absolutely no idea on Davis' vision for the show is, but it's not going to be what some folks read in fan fiction. It's going to be what he wants to create for the show. Boyd and Erica were appendiges of Derek and Issac was another sidekick for Scott and to me it makes perfect sense that some of those actors decided to leave the series when the had the chance. The actor, who portrayed Boyd was already cast in another cable series called Power. In which he had more onscreen scenes then he had on TW. Davis focuses in the characters that he wants to focus on. It's what he wants to do and the actors that portray the characters that he wants to focus on are the ones that get his attention. I just really think it's interesting that the loss of viewers and all of this fandom drama has happened during this season, when all of the cannon issues have been there since season one. Beloved characters have been leaving since season two and there was never anything like this outrage, until there wasn't enough scenes happening between Stiles and Derek to cause concern. YES. Some of those folks also have to take some of the blame for why they feel so used. Davis has been involved with the project from the very beginning. He created the characters. He created the scenes. He created the dialogues between all of these characters. He was privy to the casting of all these actors. He's seen these actors portray these characters for years now. If he really and truly wanted a pairing (any pairing for that matter) to happen, he would have wrote it all ready. He said what he felt he needed to say, along with all of the other actors for seasons now to keep folks watching: including the wronged Sterek fan base. After all this time, it never dawned on anyone to say to themselves out loud that: "They might just be telling us what we want to hear?" Yes, the fans do secure good ratings, but if the fandom desire of what the fans want, demand and feel should happen for the show is in the opposite direction of what the series producer wants the show to go, he isn't at all obligated to do what that audience wants: especially if he has the full backing of the network supporting him and his show. I'm not trying to be pro-Davis. I'm just saying that he stopped lying to a particular segment of his viewership a long time ago and folks either have to deal and accept what happened or stop hoping for things to change, because the show DID get renewed, during the height of the fandom drama. Viewers are still there.
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dalia
Junior Member
Max & Iago Forever
Posts: 387
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Post by dalia on Sept 12, 2014 19:54:34 GMT -5
I just want to clarify that while i am Sterek fan, i knew from the very beginning, that this pairing would NEVER happen onscreen.
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Post by moonstruck-me on Sept 13, 2014 4:37:41 GMT -5
Exactly. He doesn't have a vision for the show. This is a quote from Ryan Kelley who plays Deputy Parrish: That’s actually a running joke on set. Whenever someone’s like, “I don’t understand why my character would do this,” or, “This feels awkward,” the director — or whoever — will be like, “Guys, this is a show about werewolves. Just do it.” Davis just make stuff up as he goes along, like dalia said. As a viewer of the show, that gets pretty frustrating and infuriating to watch at some point. It seemed like Davis was more sure of what he was doing in season 1 and 2. I don't know what happened. And come on - some fans would like Sterek to happen but everything else in fan fiction is just for fun. I don't think you give some of the fans enough credit... and for Davis doing what he wants with the show; I think fans of TW get that now. He doesn't listen to fans and won't. After making Malia one of the main characters and force-feeding her to the fans and the "epic" love story that is Stalia, I don't think a lot of fans doubt that at all. Yes, they were. And I get that some of the characters are only supposed to be there short term - that's tv shows for you - but what I meant was that the characters (and actors) gets treated poorly. Some of the actors don't know they'll be killed off before they read their scripts and I just don't understand the need for introducing a lot of new characters when the ones you already have are perfectly fine. Why not give Isaac, Lydia or Danny more screen time instead of introducing new characters like Kira, Malia, Liam or Mason? No wonder the actors look for new jobs. I'm surprised a lot of the actors are still there... Season 4 is actually the first season without Danny, Allison and Isaac and it's the first season where Malia and Kira have been regulars. This isn't only about Sterek, however much you want it to be. There wasn't any more scenes between Derek and Stiles in season 3B than in season 4. I actually think the biggest issue is for the fans who have watched since season 1, who are know figuring out that Davis doesn't care about Lydia or Derek (and who is Danny?) and he never will. Davis said something about season 4 being more about Lydia and her story, and instead he introduced a bunch of new characters and focused on them instead. I think a lot of fans feel kind of betrayed by what Davis says but chooses to do instead. And that's totally okay...? Of course the fans should blame themselves for believing Davis and the actors... who else should they believe in. Like I said before; I think fans are starting to get now how much of a liar Davis really is. Speaking for myself, I knew that Davis was only stringing the fans along with Sterek, but some small part of me hoped that a gay writer might actually do... something. If not with Sterek, then have someone like Danny get some exciting story lines (or anything really). Again, I think the fans reach a point where they'll be like; 'it's fine you create your show the way you want to, but could you stop lying to us and treat us like we don't matter?' That's the problem. He hasn't stopped lying and in regards to Sterek, he just doesn't say anything. Why not just come out and say it? Why does he feel the need to string fans along? Surely his show is so amazing in itself that if he told the truth, people would still be watching it. Right...? And yes, the fans have to accept how Davis writes his show or stop watching. TW did get renewed and people are still watching but the ratings are dropping, so maybe everything isn't so great as it used to be. I don't know why people keep watching TW or stop watching it, I can only speak for myself. My biggest problem isn't with the show or how Davis wants to write and create it (even though it's horrible imo). I think it's unnecessary to treat fans badly (and it's not just Davis who does it) and lie to them. If Danny isn't going to show up in season 4, why not tell the truth and say he won't be showing up? It's not like Davis has created Danny to be an important part of the show anyway.
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Post by jjose712 on Sept 13, 2014 8:02:15 GMT -5
not only does Davis not care about his characters, he doesn't care about the audience who watches his show. the ones who are passionate and the reason he is even getting a 5th season. i'm not saying he should completely give in to what the fandom wants - but for him to listen would be nice. the man has no complete vision for this show. he has no show bible, no timeline, he's just making shit up as he goes along and he ran it into the ground. this show wasn't ever great, but it was fun and made you care about the characters. look what he's done to it. Derek is barely a main character anymore, he has no interaction with Stiles because of the popularity of Sterek, he shoves new characters at us telling us we'll love them (Malia) instead of giving other more established characters a real story (Lydia), PoC drop like flies, women don't fare much better, plots don't even make sense anymore or you don't even remember things that happened (the alpha pack's purpose? anyone?). i knew when Davis said "we're not done with Danny yet" that Danny wasn't going to show up in Season 4, because Season 4 was already done and Holland said he wasn't around. maybe he'll throw him in Season 5, but he won't have a substantial role. he'll get to stand on the sidelines with Mason. the sad thing is that fan fiction is so much better than the actual show. Davis does have a "vision" for his show. It's just a vision that is not at all what a certain segment of the online fandom wants to see. Or has finally admitted in what they only want to see. I personally feel that certain folks allowed themselves to be duped, because they played along in the "will they/won't they game" with Davis, O'Brien, Hochhlin and the other castmates of TW about Sterek and did not realize that it was just a game. The show was and will never go there with Sterek or Stiles coming out as bisexual. Especially after season two. Davis, as the series producer knew about the chemistry between Stiles and Derek and still didn't get inspired about it at all. That should have been caught by everyone that nothing Sterek was going to happen. The character of Derek, from what I've seen was never supposed to always be a main character. Especially over drawing focus away from Scott character, whose character is what Teen Wolf was created around. All the arguments/issues about the female characters, characters of color and lack of gay, lesbian and bi characters has always been there since season one, but everything was "fine" as long as there also was a scene of Derek pushing Stiles into some lockers or Stiles saying something idiotic about Derek, boys finding him attractive or Danny saying some throwaway line about his sexuality (to make sure to keep viewers up to date that he was gay). Yet, this time it's just too much, because the show stopped having scenes between Derek with Stiles and Danny disappearing? I get that certain folks are pissed, but don't lay all the blame on MTV, Davis and not on the actors (especially Tyler Posey - who some folks act like he's the Devil Incarnate). Let's see if the show doesn't get renewed after this next upcoming season, because it did get renewed, right at the height of all this online fandom drama/fallout. Because there are viewers still watching this show. Much more than those in the online fandom. Sorry, but no. I couldn't care less for Sterek, in my opinion it was very obvious from the beginning that Sterek will be forever fanfiction material and nothing more, no matter how the actors (yes, they are to blame too) and Jeff hinted that there was a possibility. Styles bisexuality is a different story, because it was hinted again and again from the beggining of the show, it was hinted in interviews, but at the end nothing was delivered. And of course then there was Danny, Danny was a sidekick character in season one, he appeared every three episodes deliver a funny line and that's all. The actor was ignored at TW panels at comic cons (he was there anyway because Keahu really likes comic cons). Jeff Davis promised more Danny, because hey, the fans like him, but that never translated in real screen time. And now, he dissapeared because for Jeff, Danny is useless if he doesn't have an straight best friend or a werewolf to sleep with. I find incredibly pathetic that a gay writer thinks that is impossible to integrate a gay character (that people really like) into a big cast, because his only role is supporting straight characters (and the fact that Mason share exactly the same qualities makes me think that this is the only way Davis is able to create gay characters). But that's not really the problem, the problem is they insist in fool the fans. If you don't want gay characters on your show, or they are simply to deliver a phrase every three episodes because of course a gay character can't be part of the main storyline, well just write that, but stop pretending that your show is gay friendly. Stop trying to get praise for how inclusive your show is. And yes, the actors are the less responsible on this, but they are actively putting their faces on interviews to praise how epic was the gay love story (i don't know what gay storyline) and how gay characters are treated exactly the same the straight characters (and they are good actors because they are able to say that without cracking into hysterical laughs). It's simple, write the show whatever you want, but stop trying to sell it like it's inclusive because it's not. Stop doing your promo on gay sites, stop making the actors lie to promote the show. If that's the show you want, simply own it. Of course the ratings are not that good anymore, and you want more people watching it, but lying only gives you backlash And Jeff should be cautious because this could end like DaVinci's demons, and that could damage the promo for his new shows. I notice that lately the reactions when creators or actors give ambiguous answers about the gay characters on a show don't get the same reaction that used to have. Now people instead of being excited got suspicious. I say it before and i repeated, i prefer a straight head writer who is able to fight for his gay characters than a gay writer who seems to think we are still in the 80's and a barely there token character is more than enough. To have a gay main character on TW would be very very easy. Spartacus was destined to main male straight audiences, there was some backlash for its gay scenes, but the writer always treated his gay characters like the straight ones. And i recognize i was quite cynical after the death of the two main gay characters in season one, but he really delivered what he promised, and more gay characters were created on the following seasons
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dmagiclight
Full Member
OPEN YOUR MIND AND ANY THING IS CAN HAPPEN
Posts: 1,657
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Post by dmagiclight on Sept 13, 2014 11:01:42 GMT -5
you said everything I was thinking jjose712 thank you I will never understand why Jeff Davis always has to make the gay character the side kick to the straight character as an out gay man you would think he would or could switch It around why the gay character can not be A part of the core group,It make no sense to me and as some people have said he created and writes the show so He really could
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angel
Junior Member
Posts: 390
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Post by angel on Sept 13, 2014 12:54:48 GMT -5
I just really think it's interesting that the loss of viewers and all of this fandom drama has happened during this season, when all of the cannon issues have been there since season one. Beloved characters have been leaving since season two and there was never anything like this outrage. Thats because of something thats called hopes. All human beings have a need for hope in all way of life. When you like something, also a TV Show, also if you dont like it anymore, you have allways hopes for it, that it could be better in the future, specialy when the hopes are not out of the blue and instead confirmed from the official site. But someday it comes the time that this hopes dies, and this time is from human to human different, but now its by the most humans this time arrived.
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